Hunting Section - what are your thoughts about the killing of Cecil the Lion?
When I first heard about it I didn't pay much attention. I figured it was just another story about liberals getting upset over a legal hunt.
But as I've heard more about it, it sounds like there were several legal and/or ethical issues.
Consider the following:
1. There are reports that the local guides may not have had the proper tags or permits to hunt a lion. If that's true, do you think the American who paid for a guided hunt should be held responsible?
2. They baited the lion and lured him off of a nature preserve into an area where hunting was legal. Does anyone know if baiting is legal in that area? and if so if there are any legal implications for the fact that they specifically lured the animal off of the preserve?
3. They targeted the dominant male in a pride. Anyone who knows lion behavior knows that when the dominant male is killed the remaining males will fight for dominance. The winner will kill all the cubs in the pride and several females will be hurt or killed attempting to defend their young. This means dozens more lions will die. If the hunters had targeted one of the non-dominant males none of this would happen.
4. Normally the money from guided hunts provides a great source of revenue for conservation and anti-poaching enforcement. But Cecil was a well known tourist attraction so his death will probably mean a decrease in revenue. However this is just speculation on my part.
Ultimately, was this an act of poaching? Any other thoughts or comments?
Additionally, he was shot with a bow and it took an estimated 40 hours to track him and eventually kill him with a firearm. Does anyone have comments or info on whether bow hunting for lion is considered acceptable from an ethical standpoint?
- 5 years ago
The guy relied on guides to perform the trophy hunt according to local rules and regulations. He s an experienced hunter, so he may have a pretty good handle on legal hunting in Zimbabwe. Whatever the case, he'll have to answer for his actions.
That being said, no one knew who Cecil the lion was just a few short days ago. With homosexuals being dropped from rooftops by Islamic extremists and unborn children being dissected so their body parts can be sold seems like much more pressing issues to the U.S. and the world than the manufactured sympathy for this poor lion. If everyone wants to be focused on Zimbabwe, maybe they should take a closer look at Mr. Robert Mugabe and his less than stellar (see: abysmal) human rights record. Cecil is a distraction that will have to get in line behind the actual atrocities occurring in the world.Source(s): http://www.history.com/topics/robert-mugabe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gr7d1sTDNts https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWQuZMvcFA8
- Staap ItLv 75 years ago
I certainly agree with most here. George Patton, and CTM to the greatest extent. I said when I saw the story first time they should hang the two guides. The Dentist...supposedly he has done several of these hunts. Don't tell me he is innocent of not knowing what was going on. I see NO reason to travel half way around the world to kill a large animal. Did this guy eat his tiger ? Is he gonna eat his Lion ? This kind of slob REALLY gets my goat.I value all living things VERY highly.
Two things about this make me sick. I mean sick.
One this so called hunter did not even take the responsibility of putting a good shot on the animal. I mean really the poor animal suffered Waaaay to long. That is nothing less then a disgrace, a disgrace to all Sportsmen who value such grand animals. I mean Live grand animals.
Second, I see no difference in if this is this idiots thing, why not just go shoot a darn Cow standing in some farmer's pasture. Really, isn't the hunting part missing completely ? And to go half way around the world to shoot someones beloved pet ? I mean that suuks. Could you would you shoot a Deer in the woods if you saw someone put a Hunter Orange vest on it. Any Sportsman would know first that is NOT fair. Someone made a friend, a very unusual experience to have a wild animal trust a human, what fool could knowing violate that trust ? Some things like a murder's act just are not acceptable.
There is NO excuse or forgiveness in my soul for a poacher. And destroying another person's pet is more then I can imagine. In this case many cared about Cecil's life. I find it sickening, the whole darn story.
Y'all know I am a Sportsman, I do enjoy hunting. Honestly, I value more highly the times, I have lowered my gun, and let an easy shot go cause it was too easy. I see, no disgrace in an empty game bag. It is the time out there with friends, and the hunt, successful or not, that is the point.
- SMLv 65 years ago
You asked a provoking question, over the past couple of days this dentist and his actions have been a social media hotbed. Do I agree with how this hunt was conducted, absolutely not. Should the PH and guide service be held accountable; yes to the fullest extent possible. Did this hunter conduct himself in the utmost of unethical hunting behavior; yes I believe he did.
It blows my mind that this happened in the way it's being presented by the media and in the social media circles. In my hunts to Africa the PH and services that I've used have been totally professional, ethical, and have a working relationship with the local game officials. Personally there is no way I would use a service that would conduct this hunt in the manner it was done.
BUT, now I have a bigger concern that has come about as a result of this hunt. There are anti hunting persons who are lighting up social media and even the network news over this. This morning I learned that this dentist had the address to his place of business posted online and he has had to close it do to threats against him.
Who's next the guy who frames houses for a living and gets his first 150 class white tail and post it on facebook? Is someone going to portray him as a bad person and call for him to be put out of business? It's sad that this country has gotten to the point that there is more concern over a dumba$$ who wasted his money and showed his inadequacies as a hunter; than there is about the homeless, uneducated, and veterans who struggle every day.
- 5 years ago
As a hunter it depends how he was taken. If he was poached which very well may be the case then it was a
horrible act done in poor sport and taste. If he was baited as well that is also in poor taste as it takes away the challenge of the hunt in fair sport. So basically if this lion was taken in the accused manner illegally then these guys (guides and hunters) should be fined and jailed and never allowed to hunt again anywhere in the world.
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- The Freak ShowLv 75 years ago
I have no problem with safari style hunting in general. From what I've read, it can be done ethically and responsibly. It can also provide money for conservation that leaves the future of the animals farther ahead than if the hunt never happened. From what I've read, this was sketchy at best. It undermines organizations and individuals who attempt to do things the correct way.
If there is a crime here, and there needs to be more investigation, then ALL members who knowingly participated should be punished.
- Russ in NOVALv 75 years ago
I could do a lot better things with $50K than shoot an old lion. I fully believe in the vast majority of hunting in the US to control populations and provide food, but I never really understood the appeal of sport hunting. It's one thing if you want to hunt a lion with a spear or grizzly with a muzzle loader or climb 10,000 ft in rugged terrain for longhorn, but luring an old lion out to shot it doesn't sound much like an accomplishment. It is one thing if an animal population needs to be culled and inviting rich fat cats to come in put money into the the local community, but is quite another when an animal is lured from a protective area just to shoot, especially if that animal as become used to the site of man.
I also don't think bow hunting is particularly humane if you are fairly assured of a quick death.
- 5 years ago
If and I do mean IF the news can be trusted to tell the truth then this isn't the Dentist's 1st disreputable act as a "hunter". Apparently a few years back he illegally killed a Black Bear in one area and transported over 40 miles away to where it would have been legal. If and I do mean IF this is true then this dentist is no hunter by any definition I care to use.
- BBeanLv 75 years ago
I think the dentist should pay a fine that will be like pulling eye teeth. He is a poacher and not a sportsman. Yes, he paid a premium for the privilege to be the most unpopular hunter in the world. The lion can and will be replaced by nature for the position of leader of the pride but I don`t think a bloodbath will happen because of the environment they have adapted to.
Just hope a taxidermist of high level skill will get the job of preserving that old lion because people can still see it up close without danger. I, also, hope the dentist never gets permanent ownership, but for some quirk of the law that he does then I hope everyone that he attempts to show his quarry to realizes that he is a world class ***hole.
Response to bow hunting: Howard Hill downed many big game animals with a long bow. He was also an expert on shot placement in an era when people thought differently. I have no negative remarks about what hunting tool people choose as long as they are responsible for themselves and don`t rely on unconcerned tax payers to pick up the tab for their adrenaline rush/extreme sport when all goes south. That goes for mountain climbers and hikers as well.
Killing with an arrow is usually not an instant death but a slow bleed-out. It can be minutes or long hours and the hunter should have the means to expedite the situation. I am not in tears about lions because they would help themselves to my livestock but would honor the code of ethics and sportsmanship hunting them.
- 5 years ago
Trophy hunting is nothing but serial murder. The self proclamed trophy hunters are nothing but cowards and muderers. They came accross the globe just to slaughter beautiful wildlife. And why? To the sole purpose of look "macho". There is nothing macho, brave, cool or strong about killing an innocent sentient being. We are animals like them, not gods. They share our capacity for love, compassion, pain and emotions. While unlike us, they do not kill for pleasure like this monsters. Killing for pleasure can't possibly be tolerated. And a nation that glorify the slaughter and raise his sons into believe it's a right thing is barbaric and horrorific.
- Anonymous5 years ago
Palmer's a psychpath. Good thing he was discovered before he killed more and moved on the humans to satisfy his blood lust. I am worried about his wife and kids. If he can't kill because he's in hiding, he might turn on them to get his kill fix.The cops need to capture this beast soon.