Arizonans: How did we almost pass such a terrible law?
You know the one. The one where being a religious business owner gave you the right to refuse service to people based on their sexual orientation. The only thing between sanity and this law passing was Jan Brewer, and she is crazy enough to think concealed weapons in bars are a good idea.
How did this almost happen?
@jaker: You just made me even more sad for my state...
@serenely, soMEone : Oh come on. If it were any other demographic, blacks, Jews, people with blue eyes... You'd likely see it as a really stupid bill.
@wendy c: The people I vote for tend to not get elected. But ten, I am not above putting Batman down as a write in.
@Ditka: I can't buy into slippery slope arguments like that. I don't see how the government telling businesses to take those, "Irish need not apply" signs out of their windows did any harm or lead to anything else harmful. I also think the idea that all men are created equal applies to whether you are religious or not. Being religious should not give you a right to bigoted business practices.
@Ditka: So you are all for businesses deciding who they they do business with based on moral reasons that are religious, but not where they do business based on moral convictions based on matters that are politically controversial? the NFL is a business too.
Actually, I addressed your morality bit earlier. The, "Irish need not apply" thing. I think it sometimes is right for the government to enforce morality and do not think it always results in much overreach. We actually have lots of mostly popular laws aimed at dong just that.
And lets face it. Some things are clearly immoral. You would have no respect for business that refuses to serve blacks. It is flat out hatred that benefits no one in any way. I think that is true no matter the demographic being discriminated against.
- DitkaLv 76 years agoFavorite Answer
Regardless of how you feel about gays, it's very dangerous to allow the Government to set the rules of how you do business.. The Government has no place is someone's personal business.. When you allow the Government to set your moral laws, you are giving the government the power to make a determination based on politics.. Lets say "just for an example" that the Government is allowed to make moral judgments, and THEY decided being gay was immoral.. That opens the possibilities to be arrested for just being gay simply because the Government deemed it as immoral...
This is the argument... and simply allowing the Government the power to pass and enforce moral beliefs is very very dangerous..
Although I do NOT agree that a business SHOULD reject business because of their sexual choice, it's still their business and if they want to make that choice they should have that right.. Believe me ones that do the market will take care of them and eventually drive them out of business.. BUT its FAR MORE dangerous to allow the Government the power to enforce moral beliefs.
To prove my point.. The NFL threatened to pull the superbowl out of Arizona if they she didn't veto that bill.. Tell me the decision wasn't political.. and honestly The NFL committed a crime to Politically threaten the State of Arizona to control the outcome.. I'm a huge NFL fan, but I hope the Commissioner gets sued for illegally using its power and trying to control a decision by illegally threatening the Governor and the state of Arizona to control the outcome of a STATE bill. ..
edit... You simply don't understand do you?? It's NOT a slippery slope.. This has NOTHING to do with Religious beliefs or Gay beliefs.. It has to do with The Government having the ability to decide what is moral and what is not.. It plain and simple is NOT the governments place...
and YES the NFL is a business too.. That does NOT make it LEGAL for anyone, or any BUSINESS to make threats to steer the decision of a bill or state law.. The NFL committed a crime PERIOD and I hope the commissioner pays dearly.. and YES I am a huge NFL fan I just hate when any organization uses its powers to effect law... You'd be screaming too IF every contracted doctor in the state threatened to pull their services IF the State Government didn't ban abortion! Plain and simple you can NOT use threats to control a political outcome.
And YES I am for businesses having the right to their moral convictions (religious or personal doesn't matter) and sticking to their moral convictions.. The same as I am for Gays having the right to their moral convictions.. You have the right to live your moral convictions BUT not force others to change theirs JUST to accommodate yours.. Plain and simple.. If a business doesn't want to serve you because of how you believe, you can go someplace else where your convictions are accepted BUT not demand the other to change their convictions just to accommodate you. We ALL are entitled to moral convictions.. NOT just gays.
And YES I agree I would have NO RESPECT for a place that refused service to anyone for their personal choices.. BUT I have a choice.. I don't have to patronize that place of business and either would many people.. Eventually the market would take care of that... But again It's not MY place to force MY moral beliefs on anyone, and it certainly is not the Governments place.
BTW I'm not Gay and do not personally believe in the Gay lifestyle, BUT I support their right to choice, but not to force acceptance or flaunt to their lifestyle upon those that simply don't agree.. Again WE ALL have the right of choice but we don't have the right to demand others to accommodate that choice. That's why we call it CHOICE.. some agree with you and some don't.. but when you make that choice you must accept and respect the other side NOT force them to change to accommodate your choice.
@ El Nerdo Loco ... nice clean debate.. it's rare on here when you can have a civilized debate rather then just nasty name calling.. good luck to you. and your state..
- Mercadies2000Lv 76 years ago
It doesn't matter if someone is religious or not, and not all who aren't like gays. What does matter is the government telling you who you can and cannot serve, this is a free country and they should be able to serve who they want. It will be people like you who will soon see how many freedoms we are loosing and what the end result will be. By the way, how would anyone know you were gay when you go into an establishment unless you were flaunting it?
- Anonymous6 years ago
Under current Arizona law, if a business wanted to discriminate against gays, they would not need this bill to be passed to do so. It is not currently illegal for a business to deny service to someone because they are gay. Some cities in Arizona have ordinances against it but there is no state law against it. If business owners in Arizona wanted to deny service to gays, they could do so in most of the state under current law.
- YahoouserLv 76 years ago
This reminds me of down south prior to 1960
Lunch counters that were for whites only!
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- Anonymous6 years ago
I think it has something to do with Christians with DOGS taking a cab ride at an airport and being refused transport due to the fact that the blind Christian has a seeing eye dog and the driver is a muslim
- RadhikaLv 46 years ago
Bars are the worst place to carry weapons as alcohol and gunpowder are indeed a lethal mixture.
- Anonymous6 years ago
I know, right? I mean, gays should be forced to eat where govt tells them to and businesses must cower to PC demands.
- !California Guy!Lv 46 years ago
I was a bit disappointed that the bill didn't pass however I can understand why it was vetoed, Arizona can not afford another blow to their image after their infamous immigration law.
- Creek10Lv 56 years ago
Its sad to see the people from Arizona and State General Assembly members (Conservatives) pushing more bigotry, and hatred for State laws.
- Anonymous6 years ago
Redistricting that's how they got in. Popular vote dose not mean anything anymore it's how you draw the map.