Christian(s) What use is there for a Messianic Jew to continue in the Law?
I heard a "gentile" say that he now "feels more complete", since he began working together with a Messianic Jew."
Is there a benefit to the law that we non-Jewish Christians are missing out on? OR is it frivilous and wrong to base your belief in the old testament Jewish pattern of worship?
- DS MLv 67 years agoBest Answer
Mark S says: ***They have been repudiated by every Jewish organization on the planet.***
Obviously, Mark S obviously rejects the Jewish scriptures, given to us by God, as the place from which to get the definition of what makes a Jew a Jew...and admits that the modern definition is not only totally man made. This is clear to all who read his response (which can't be called an answer because it doesn't answer the question) because his non-Messianic Jewish answer omits God and God's instruction (law) and replaced it with a higher authority...the opinion of the Jewish community which he finds noteworthy.
This is not new. As Numbers 14 demonstrates, the giver of God's law to the Jewish community wanted to kill Moses and go back to Egypt. Using this scriptural model, it easy to understand why Rabbinic Judaism identifies with the Jewish community voting to kill Moses as what it means to be Jewish.
***What use is there for a Messianic Jew to continue in the Law?***
When the Creator made us, He made it for a reason. That reason is why we are alive. When we do what we are made to do, that is what is "right." Everything else is "wrong." The reason to continue in the law is because it defines who we are.
If we abandoned the law as non-Messianic Jews, then instead of standing before the throne of God as a priest of the nations and receiving a peace that transcends understanding, we could boast that no one in our community have consciously been aware of any prayer being answered including those of what God wants them to do during their lifetime.
And that is it, isn't it? The difference between a Jewish prophet and the Messianic community and a Jewish rabbi and their congregations is the ability to hear and respond to the spirit of God.
Seriously, how could anyone say they are doing the will of God unless thye know what He made them to do during their lifetime and do it as He equipped and commissioned them/us to do? What other law is greater than doing what God made us to do during our lifetime?
After the resurrection of the Jewish Messiah, the disciples went to Jerusalem as instructed. On the day of Pentecost, 120 JEWS were filled with the spirit of God as all the prophets fulfilling Jewish scripture (Joel 2). All Believers trace their spiritual heritage back to this JEWISH event created and made possible by HaShem.
Isn't a word before Acts 11. The Jewish Messiah never converted to another religion or claimed to start a new one. Neither did any of His disciples. So where do you get the idea that Christians stopped being Jews?
Finally, Abraham had a covenant with HaShem 430 years before the law was given. During that time,
:"And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine; and he was priest of G-d the Most High. 19 And he blessed him, and said: 'Blessed be Abram of G-d Most High, Maker of heaven and earth; 20 nd blessed be G-d the Most High, who hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand.' And he gave him a tenth of all.
***And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine; and he was priest of G-d the Most High. 19 And he blessed him, and said: 'Blessed be Abram of G-d Most High, Maker of heaven and earth; 20 and blessed be G-d the Most High, who hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand.' And he gave him a tenth of all.***
The priesthood of Melchizedek is greater than Aaron's because Melchizedek was Abraham's priest. Abraham didn't need Moses' law and Aaron's priesthood is the lesser priesthood.Source(s): 1. http://www.breslov.com/bible/Genesis14.htm#1
- Lost ProphecyLv 77 years ago
Well for starters Messianic Jews are not Jews they are actually a modern Evangelical movement that incorporated Mosaic Laws into their beliefs and use Jewish terminology and practices. Before Christians were called Christians they were the Nazarene (aka. followers of the way) in which they followed the teachings of Jesus which was taught by the Apostles and followed the ordinances of Mosaic Law that is until St. Paul arrived because prior before St. Paul the Gentile (Non-Jewish) converts were forced to follow the ordinances of Mosaic Law. There were Jewish converts but not that many of them because most Jews viewed the Nazarene as being heretics which is why I encourage people to read the Book of Acts, the Apostles were rejected by the Jews and were kicked out of their synagogues. And of course not many Gentiles (Non-Jews) were converting because they were forced to follow the ordinances of Mosaic Law. When St. Paul arrived he taught them that Jesus had fulfilled the Mosaic Law for them that they were no longer bound by the ordinances of Mosaic Law for these Laws were made for the people of Israel under the Old Covenant. Well there was a divide within the Nazarene the ones that accepted the teachings of St. Paul would be called the Christians. The ones who rejected the teachings of St. Paul would remain the Nazarene but because they rejected the teachings of St. Paul an Apostle chosen by Jesus Himself they had lost the Apostolic Succession. Now when this transition taken place there were some that no longer forced the ordiencence of Mosaic Law upon others but they themselves continued to follow these ordienances they were called the Hebrew Christians like what St. Paul was a Hebrew Christian. The ones that didn't follow the ordinances of Mosaic Law were your Christians. If you read the Paulin Epistles in the New Testament they actually discourage following the ordinances of Mosaic Law.
Today there are Hebrew Catholics that live in Israel. The Catholic Church made an exception for them being that they are Jewish converts but they didn't want to abandon following the ordinances of Mosaic Law.
- DalanLv 57 years ago
If you read your Scriptures you will find that the Law is not just for the Jews, even though they think so.
Exodus 12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.
If we accept this verse, then those who are of HEBREW descent , not just those of the House of Judah, and those who are not of the House of Israel are to keep the same law! Not too hard to understand.
Deu 30:19 I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:
This verse comes after Moses explains to the people of Israel all of the blessings and curses of keeping the commandments and not keeping the commandments.
Do I need to explain more to answer your question about what use is it?
The Law was never intended for just one group of people and off limits to others. If we choose to follow the Elohim of Israel, then we need to listen to what He has to say. HE tells us to "Obey My voice" and He will be our Elohim. Simple.
He is not a respecter of persons that He would give all of these laws to one group, the "Jews" and then say to another group "you don't have to do anything but believe". Doesn't sound like respect to me.
When we look at the feast days there is something more to them than just obeying the law. They are a prophetic road map of Elohim's plan of redemption.
If you don't understand Passover and Unleavened Bread it makes understanding the crucifixion week very confusing. If you understand about the Feast of Trumpets, you have a hint at what time the Messiah is returning.
The idea that these laws are Jewish is incorrect. The Jews are the ones who have kept them throughout the ages. But the laws are Elohim's, not Moses'.
Those who say that Messianic Believers are out to "save" the Jew are sooo confused. If you try to explain why you believe what you believe they won't listen. They keep to the same old talking points about how we as keepers of the Torah and believers in the Messiah Yahshua are just pretending to be "Jews" and want to bring them over to the christian faith. I won't say that there aren't those who behave this way, but to say that all of us are this way is like saying that all Americans are Texans or New Yorkers. That statement simply isn't true. The same holds true about Messianics.
What the Jews won't tell you is that they don't believe in the concept of sin, because if they did they would have to figure out how to be forgiven and since there is no alter or priesthood to receive the sacrifices it's just easier to drop the concept.
Christianity kept the concept of sin, but have forgotten what it is, since they don't live by the law. They nullify their jesus by this belief.
- Anonymous7 years ago
Some of the Messianic Jews are worried that their relatives will reject them if they don't keep acting like other Jews. Most traditional Jews dislike Messianics intensely from what I've noticed. Also some Messianics don't even want to call themselves Christians. They think of themselves as enlightened Jews or completed Jews. There is no benefit to going back to previous laws that Jesus has corrected.
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- SandylynnLv 67 years ago
Scripture is pretty clear on what Christ's work on the cross has done for us...freed us from the law of sin & death. Read Ephesians...Steps Toward the Fulfillment of God's Purpose (chs. 2-3); Salvation of Individuals by Grace (2:1-10); Reconciliation of Jew and Gentile through the Cross (2:11-18); Uniting of Jew and Gentile in One Household (2:19-22). Christians (which include Messianic Jews) are no longer under the law. We are under grace, which is what Christ extended to us through His death & resurrection. The law points out that we're sinners & in need of salvation through a perfect blood sacrifice. God's requirement was satisfied with Jesus' sacrifice on the cross, spilling His blood for all who will accept His provision for our sins. The work was finished on the cross...the law has been fulfilled on the cross. As Jesus said..."It is finished". <*)))><
- DavidsLv 67 years ago
Ask yourself this,
If God's Word died on that cross, did he not rise again from the dead fully as he had been? Was that not the same God's Word that went into the grave that rose again from it?
Paul taught the Jewish believers that when pagan's accepting Christ/Messiah (Christians) followed the law without being taught the law, it was proof of God writing His Word on their (our) hearts. (Book of Romans)
What is it we are supposed to obey God in if not "His Word"?
The real problem is not obeying the Mosaic Law, Jesus obeyed even ROMAN law, not just the Mosaic Law. In fact, it was Jesus obedience to ALL applicable law (in his life, at that time) which killed him. He fulfilled both Mosaic Law AND Roman law as it applied to his life. It was submission to also Roman law that killed him. The Jews had no authority to kill them, they had to get the Roman's to order it.
Why do you obey the laws of your own country? For the same reason Jews have been obeying Mosaic law all along (well, some do, and so don't). It is the law for Israel.
The New Covenant writes God's laws for each one of us according to God's will for you, for me and for each one in God's kingdom. Why would anyone be surprised if God commands me to observe a Saturday Sabbath? Or to dress modestly? Or to show respect for my husband? Why would anyone be surprised a Christian man gets told by God to take good care of his family, give them proper medical care or care rightly for his elderly parents?
Oh, those are OT "laws"?
Maybe, they are God's will. Just as Prince William broke protocol when his ill wife left the hospital by having her walk in front of him. Our "Lord" is more merciful than rules and regulations. Queen Elizabeth II bowed her head when the coffin of Diana passed by her. What did it cost her but pride? Nothing else, yet, it too is against tradition/custom/"protocol."
The OT is like this, it HAS value. And without Jesus we might never have learned it is God who teaches us, in what order to learn what, and that to heal a man on the Sabbath is more conforming to God's will than rules.
Read the first two chapters of Romans, contrary to what I was taught in Churches, it is written to Nazoreans (Jewish Christians) who were placing too much emphasis on adherence to the law. Paul does not say the law is not worth having, he reminds them we are under the New Covenant.
Think of what this world would be like without law for all those who do NOT have Christ. No one would understand any right or wrong. It would be chaos. If man's laws can be good, how much more so God's.
- TigerLv 77 years ago
The law has nothing. God`s moral law stays forever, but the sacrificial law is gone. This was a great problem during the first Church as many meant they should keep at least some of the old customs. That never worked that time and will never work today. It is the same as to say; I am a Christian now, but I will still meet my buddy's at the bar saturday evening, and have a beer. It just never can work together.
21 Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, 24 which things are symbolic. For these are the[d] two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar— 25 for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children— 26 but the Jerusalem above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written:
“Rejoice, O barren,
You who do not bear!
Break forth and shout,
You who are not in labor!
For the desolate has many more children
Than she who has a husband.”[e]
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are children of promise. 29 But, as he who was born according to the flesh then persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, even so it is now. 30 Nevertheless what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.”[f] 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman but of the free.
- sunshineLv 67 years ago
There are Christians who are turned in their understanding of " The Gospel of Jesus Christ" due to evil men who creep in unaware, teaching false doctrines. Many have itching ears and will listen.
Not even the Jews can observe the Law in its original observance. Nor the Hebrew Roots individuals, which is a huge part of the falling away of the truth of the gospel of Christ.
To observe the Law and the Feasts of the Old Testament EVERONE of these first of all MUST do this in Jerusalem Israel.(and thy don't) ( and they can't it is not possible) Also Jesus said " It is finished". WHY do these individuals continue to swallow this nonsence and think they can keep doing the Law and earn salvation?
Jesus said IT IS DONE. No-one can climb up any other way to heaven to the Father God, except through the FINNISHED work of Jesus on the cross. No ONE.
Yes it is frivolous and worthless. You simply can not go back. The Jews could not keep the Law, and Paul said to Peter, " why do you ask the gentile to keep the Law when we ourselves could not " ?
- pappygLv 67 years ago
The Old Testament law was "taken out of the way" it has been fulfilled by Christ.
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Jesus said Mat_5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Joh 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.
The Old Testament law was taken out of the way at the death of Jesus on that cross. All the Jews were told by John the Baptist and Jesus they must believe Jesus to be the Messiah and to repent and be baptized for the remission of sins, to be saved. In Acts chapter 2 the world was told to-Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Even those Jews who were baptized under Johns baptism needed to be re baptized under the authority of the Godhead.
IN 70Ad when Jerusalem was destroyed the Jewish people were never God's people again. God changed the law so he changed his people and their new name was given them in Antioch.
Act 11:26 And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
The Nation of Israel today are not God's chosen people.
They are still looking for an earthly king to sit upon an earthly kingdom to rule over an earthly Nation that God never promised them.
Jesus said-Joh_18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
Those who look for the same today have missed the mark the same as they
Jesus is now King and Priest.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:Source(s): KJV
- Anonymous7 years ago
Quite simply, because God commands it from ALL believers. God's covenants are everlasting. The first covenant wasn't abolished when the second one was given. Only now, we no longer require animal sacrifices because Yeshua is the perfect sacrificial Lamb.