Why do so many non Catholic Christians oppose abortion when...?
...it's a position that does not come from Biblical teaching but Catholic dogma and notions of "ensoulment".
Not only is abortion not considered murder in Biblical law but God was reported delivering non-consensual abortions in the Old Testament!
I just wonder why Protestant and other non Catholics anti abortionists claim their religion as the cause for their anti abortion stance when the history of the pro life movement is one of distinctly non biblical Catholic dogma being the basis for a protest movement!
Here's a biblical line for you Christians.
Give them, O LORD: what wilt thou give? give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. -- Hosea 9:14
God approves of miscarrying wombs.
Denver, that line from Leviticus says "And he that killeth any MAN shall surely be put to death."
Fetus =/= man.
"...so that her fruit depart from her..."
You're wrong Jim.
You forgot to read the commentary Jimmy.
"If two men fight and cause a woman to miscarry, but do not hurt her, then the one who hurt her shall pay her husband an amount determined by the judges. Only if the woman dies is the punishment to be death. Apparently, then, with respect to abortion, God is pro-choice since he considers a woman's life to be more important than that of the fetus."
Again you are wrong.
Why do you defend Catholic dogma so hard if you aren't Catholic?
marshmallow, you are so wrong about the way biology works I suspect that you must be a different species. Probably a vegetable!
You can look up any of the quotes from the Skeptics Annotated Bible and find them in the King James, American Standard Version or whatever other online bible source you like.
Go right ahead. It's an open source document. Show me that their bible quotes aren't exactly the same ones from scripture!
Unsurprisingly not one single Christian has shown an inkling of knowledge about the history of the RCC in the anti abortion movement nor been able to do much except bleat biblical admonishments of killing completely ignoring the fact that the bible does not consider fetuses to be human for the reasons outlined above and that the God of the bible kills 'em with merry abandon throughout the whole bible!
I take it you are unaware that for SERIOUS breaches of OT crimes a "fine" didn't cut it. Serious crimes demand death or worse, but strangely not abortion. Funny that.
Greg, the guy is only put to death if the WOMAN dies.
Here Jim, look at this-carefully
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed.
That's Genesis, thou shalt not kill and all the rest of that. If a man accidently kills a woman when performing an abortion THEN he is killed.
Completely missed that bit didn't you.
Also no response to Gods forced abortions, thought you were anti abortion. My mistake.
- Greg JLv 68 years ago
Where do I begin with the inconsistencies?
Let's see. First, the top two excerpts on the skepticsannotatedbible site have at least one contradiction. The commentary on the second excerpt says that "The Bible places no value on fetuses or infants less than one month old." However, the previous verse discussed the fine to be paid if someone causes a woman to miscarry. How can a fine be imposed on something of "no value"?
Second, this commentary itself contains inconsistencies, such as this glaring example: "If two men fight and cause a woman to miscarry, but do not hurt her, then the one who hurt her shall pay her husband...." How exactly can two men not hurt her, yet the one who hurt her has to pay? Can you really not hurt someone and still have to pay for hurting her? Or is this a misreading of the Bible to begin with?
You see, I really don't need to go any farther to discount these sources. Please do yourself a favor and do the same.
Addenda-- Chill, dude. First, I agree that the guy is only put to death if the woman dies. My point wasn't with that at all; read it again. I was pointing out that the commentator contradicts himself or herself by saying that if no one hurt her, then the one who hurt her has to pay a fine. These contradictions destroy the credibility of the entire site.
Second, we're not ignoring the Bible here, we're simply disagreeing with your trying to use bogus, biased interpretations to defend abortion. Speaking of which, has it occurred to you that an anti-anything movement needs something to be against? Maybe the anti-abortion movement did not come about until abortions had become more commonplace. In fact, your wikipedia article says abortion was always considered by the Church to be a sin. So what's your real issue here?
Looking again at the wikipedia article, we find this gem:
"This Aristotelian view of delayed ensoulment was abandoned by the 17th century, when the conviction prevailed that the soul was present from the moment of conception, and the scientific proof in 1827 of the existence of the female ovum and in 1875 of the involvement of the union of a gamete from each parent in conception reduced speculation about a delayed substantial change."
So, when the Church changes its position on something based on scientific discoveries, it's suddenly wrong? Really? Give me a break.
- Anonymous8 years ago
Skeptics annotated Bible, yeah...now that sounds like a GREAT source.
None of those scriptures are about God approving of abortion, but rather God has cursed the people under discussion for the horrible things that they have done.
My being pro life actually doesn't have much to do with my being Christian. It simply makes sense not to kill a child, even an unborn child. I guess I feel a need to speak for those who have no voice of their own. Abortion, fagawdsake, is the murder of unborn children!! It is the most sadistic, horrible thing a mother can do!! Geez, Louise, if ya don't want kids, don't...well you know!! If you are going to have irresponsible sex, at LEAST be responsible enough to admit your mistake, and human enough to let the child live!!
Abortion is murder, nothing less. A baby, even an unborn baby, is a human being...unless you think that thing growing in the pregnant woman's belly is a grapefruit. And to kill a human being is murder.
It really is as simple as that.
- Jim VLv 78 years ago
I'm not a Catholic, so the notion of "ensouldment" means nothing to me.
The "thing" being killed is a child, most usually for the conveinyence of the mother or family.
Your "Skeptic's Annotated Bible" has a skewed understanding (am I surpised? - no.)
= = = from the link = = =
Abortion is not murder. A fetus is not considered a human life.
If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life. -- Exodus 21:22-23
= = = =
This is not a statement about killing an unborn child. It is a statement about causing premature birth - "no mischief."
As you can note: "if any mischief follow" - if the child dies - THEN life for life.
<<completely ignoring the fact that the bible does not consider fetuses to be human for the reasons outlined above >>
Obviously someone can't read. The Bible does not make the statement you say it does.
- Anonymous8 years ago
Abortion is murder. As soon as the sperm from a guys penis swims it's way through the vagina to the egg, BOOM, instant living human. Atheist, Protestant, catholic, non catholic, baptist, sadist, what the f*ck ever, performing a surgery that the surgeon and the patient KNOW will KILL that innocent little baby, is MURDER. Even if you were raped, hold it out for nine months, PLEASE, then you ever won't have to think about the child, the rape, you'd move on. Abortion is MURDER.
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- XerxesLv 48 years ago
Perhaps my political beliefs don't blindly follow my religion. Have you considered that?
- Anonymous8 years ago
thou shalt not kill , remember wiki can be edited by any one, including non believing Episcopalians
- Common SenseLv 78 years ago
Abortion is murder.
See: Psalms 139:16, Leviticus 24:17, Psalms 139:15Source(s): The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures, the inspired word of Jehovah God.
- AngieLv 58 years ago
Perhaps it has nothing to do with a person's religion and more about what a person believes. Just the same as a christian of any denomination can be pro-life, so can any person of any religion. Even an atheist can be pro-life because that is what they believe.
- David GLv 68 years ago
Abortion = murder, no matter how you slice it.