Would christians please explain these trinity glitches?

1. If the christian god is one god, how come the father and son can sit next to each other on the throne?

2. How come the son can pray to the father and call him 'my god'?

3. How come the son doesn't know one the things that father knows, i.e end of the world?

4. How come we never hear the father or holy spirit call the son god.

5. At jesus's baptism, the father called him ' my son in whom i'm well pleased', doesn't this show that both are distinct and that if both are god they could be refered to as gods, unless both cannot be gods without each other, which is not possible in the case of the father, who the son prayed to as god on his own in heaven?

6. If the son is 'begotten', surely this means that he had a beginning in some point in time, which means he should be something lesser than god?

Update:

@seeker- you're are the one making the mistake of uniting two separate persons in your own mind and you want us to just accept that they are one without any evidence at all. You also invent some a plan which you say is god's, to try and explain why the son doesn't have same knowledge as his father. That is intellectual dishonesty. Please try again, your simply tryimg to explain my question away.

Update 2:

@joseph86.. I almost took seriously, until you presented yourself to be better than me. Your so called facts, are nothing but believe statements that cannot be substanciated by any evidence. You have failled dismally to answer the questions, you'd rather make excuses about how limited our knowledge is. How come at your limited knowledge you attempt to present things, that you cannot understand,as truth to others. That is deception at best.

Update 3:

@joseph86.. I almost took seriously, until you presented yourself to be better than me. Your so called facts, are nothing but believe statements that cannot be substanciated by any evidence. You have failled dismally to answer the questions, you'd rather make excuses about how limited our knowledge is. How come at your limited knowledge you attempt to present things, that you cannot understand,as truth to others. That is deception at best.

Update 4:

@smell my gun-smoke- why do you guys make up excuses everytime you dont know the answer. If you're such an finite being, how come you can comprehend the 'infiniteness' of god and explain it ti others who may not know? That is very dishonest.

Update 5:

@bill b - I dont listen to dishonest people.

11 Answers

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  • 8 years ago
    Favorite Answer

    If the son is 'begotten', surely this means that he had a beginning in some point in time, which means he should be something lesser than god?

    Couldn't agree with you more, Mboy. You just drove the nail there. Excellent Point (especially number 5)! The doctrine of the trinity is really unscriptural for in the end even the Son will be subject (as He always have been John 14:28 & John 15:20) to the Father when all things have been placed under His feet. (1 Cor. 15:24-28) It amazes Me to think that trinitarians fail to see this truth, when "the golden text" itself bears witness of this fact "for GOD so loved the world He sent His ONLY begotten Son" --- and NOT His own self; therefore Jesus (The Son) is NOT Jehovah (The Father) for to say that He Himself is Jehovah is like saying He Himself IS the Father, which is confusing and GOD is NOT the author of confusion. (1 Cor. 14:33) Though both share the same nature (Phil. 2:6 as GOD; In Hebrew Elohim which is PLURAL) just like an earthly child shares the biological threads of his mortal father (being HUMAN in nature John 3:6) this DOESN'T make Him (Jesus) EQUAL in rank, position, origin and most especially authority---just as YOUR son or child (if any) is NOT greater than you---and most of all, wasn't born ahead of you; otherwise, he'd be your father NOT your son.

    The same is true with Jesus (Wisdom: Chokmah/Sophia of GOD Prov. 8:11+ & 1 Cor. 1:24) who said:

    "The Father (Jehovah) is GREATER than I (Jesus)." (John 14:26) Indicating that He is inferior in authority and rank as Jehovah's SON---not Jehovah's Father. The Bible teaches that Jesus, as GOD's Wisdom has its origins from the beginning (Proverbs 8:24) when the Father (Jehovah) gave Him birth (Psa. 2:7 & Hebrews 1:5) to help Him (Jehovah) in "constructing" (if you will) the universe. (Prov. 8:30 & John 1:3)

    But this really is a controversial topic, isn't it? Anyhow like I said, I totally agree with your points above.

    ----------------------------------------

    at firestorm: "The trinity is a hard concept to understand.

    that is SIMPLY because, it's a concept that is UN-scriptural. The Scripture PLAINLY teaches that the Son is NOT equal to the Father (John 14:26) and this goes AFTER His ascension TO the culmination of time when Jesus (The Son) will SUBMIT Himself to His Father (Jehovah) (1 Cor. 15:24-28) and NOT vice-versa.

    Just like the analogy of an earthly father to his son who shares the same nature as HUMAN beings, so is the relationship between the Elohim (gods) the Father (Jehovah) and His Son (Jesus) whom He has given birth. (Psa. 2:7 & Hebrews 1:5) What's so "hard" and difficulty about that? Approach GOD's SIMPLE truth's like a little CHILD then your eyes will be enlightened.

    "We know that there is one God, yet He exists as three separate, yet co-equal personages... How can this be?"

    That is because the word GOD (elohim: the royal "us" Gen. 1:26 remember?) is Plural. When it says one (Heb. echad) that simply denotes UNITY---as unity in purpose and love (John 10:30; John 17:21; Romans 12:5; 1 Cor. 1:10 & Philippians 2:2) but definitely NOT a singularity.

    SIMPLE!

    Source(s): The Bible
  • Seeker
    Lv 6
    8 years ago

    That can be confusing, so follow this carefully.

    God is the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

    BUT ...

    The Father is not the Son, nor is the Son

    the Holy Spirit, neither is the Holy Spirit

    the Father, etc.

    |||

    These three Persons, the Father, the Son, and

    the Holy Spirit, all constitute for ONE GOD.

    Now why doesn't Jesus know everything the Father knows? Because the Father

    has his ultimate plan which he hasn't yet fully revealed to Jesus the Son.

    At the baptism scene, the Father and the Son are distinct, but not separate. Both are

    the same One God, don't make the mistake of separating the two in you're mind.

    The "Only Begotten" thing is an unfortunate result of the English translation of the original Greek word "Monogenes", which implies that Jesus is the "only one of his kind" Son of God, because God has only ONE SON, but that does not mean he was produced.

  • A JW no doubt, right? I don't believe in the trinity, and I'm a card carrying Protestant. I believe 100% in God, the Son and the Holy Spirit...but not a single person on the planet can know for sure how they are related at the Deity level. I honestly don't think it matters, although JWs obsess over it ad nauseum. It doesn't matter if you believe it or not. It's just another one of the many things you cannot prove or disprove. I am still saved regardless. I just chalk it up to mystery. One day God will tell me when I am with him. Until then I am fine with not knowing.

    Why don't you ask Muslims why it's encouraged to martyr yourself and your children? Or why Indians worship elephants and monkeys and blue women with multiple arms? You might find that most of this stuff was just made up long ago to fill gaps in unanswerable questions. Then men decided that others should believe like they did and this stuff became entangled in various cultures.

  • brad h
    Lv 5
    8 years ago

    Jesus was conceived in the womb by the Holy Spirit. Before that, He had always been in Heaven. So, while He was here, He was the Father's Son. And while He was here, The Father was still God, so there is nothing questionable about Jesus calling the Father "God".

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  • 8 years ago

    Once again, a non-believer attempts to limit a superior being to his own reason. God is God. We are not. That you, like me, cannot fully understand God's nature is expected, but that you believe you can teach about the God you don't know is only a sign of self importance. The facts: God is a three person deity - Father, Son and Holy Spirit, three in one and one in three, Jesus words during His earthly sojourn are the words of the human Jesus, who was fully God and fully man.

    Source(s): Isa_55:8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. Isa_55:9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
  • 8 years ago

    Ok, my interpretation, and it makes sense to me.

    The holy spirit is in you, and will make you receive and give, spiritually, When you give like me now, explaining the spiritual meaning of the trinity, I am the father, giving to the son who is receiving. When I listen to the priest who is giving, I am the son receiving, and this all is made possible by the holy spirit.

    The one God is the one true faith, enabled by the holy spirit. The son can pray to the father, and call him god.

  • 8 years ago

    I think you need to ask the bible when you're wondering about god rather than atheists.

    1. Jesus is not god he is one of the gods.

    2. Because father is a term used to help us understand what god is to us, but he has no gender nor wife so he is just God

    3. Jesus is not god, if he was he would have saved himself from the cross instead of asking god to.

    4. Because he is not god

    5. He is the son of god, but we are all considered his children and Jesus is the one he is most pleased with, and jesus did not have a human father.

    6. When he was born... *cough* jesus is not god *cough* he's just his blood son *cough*

    Source(s): New Testament
  • 8 years ago

    The Gospel of John, chapter 1, verses 1-5 reads thus:

    1IN THE BEGINNING was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word WAS God.

    2HE was in the beginning with God.

    3All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

    4In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.

    5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it. (end quote, emphasis mine)

    Let's break this down. First of all, the first verse of John 1 says that In the BEGINNING was the Word. What does that mean? Simply put, it means that the Word (note the capitalizing of Word) did not have a cause or an origin, but simply was at the beginning. Some will tell you that the term word simply refers to God's will or command, but in the latter half of verse 1 specifically states that the Word IS God. How can the Word simultaneously be WITH God and BE God if this does not refer to some other part of the trinity?

    Verse 2 states it plainly: "HE was with God in the beginning..." HE... The apostle John actually identifies the word as a personage. Who could this be but Jesus Christ?

    The idea that the Godhead consists of one deity in the form of three personages (Father, Son, Spirit) is FURTHER supported in the Genesis account of creation.

    Genesis chapter 1, starting in verse 26 reads:

    26Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth."

    27God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.

    Look at verse 26 again. "Let us make man in Our image." This seems to actually be a conversation taking place between more than a single individual. Yet Verse 27 tells us that HE created man in HIS image. Back to the singular. Who is this other person? John 1, verse 3 actually answers that question for us:

    John 1:3- All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.

    All things came into being through Him, through the Word, through Jesus Christ. If Jesus is not God, how can He have had a part in the creation?

    John 1, verses 14-17 go further:

    14And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.

    15John testified about Him and cried out, saying, "This was He of whom I said, 'He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me.'"

    16For of His fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace.

    17For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ. (end quote)

    This statement tells us that the Word BECAME Flesh. John the Baptist, who himself was known to be a prophet of God stated of Jesus, "This is he of whom I said, 'He who comes after me has a higher rank than I, for He existed before me'!" John CLEARLY recognized the deity and eternal nature of Jesus, so why should there be any doubt?

    There are a lot more proofs such as these, Hebrews, Revelation, and Romans are good places to start, places where Jesus Christ is identified as God and as the Son of God. The trinity is a hard concept to understand. We know that there is one God, yet He exists as three separate, yet co-equal personages... How can this be? It is simply a mystery, one of the great things beyond our understanding.

    What I DO know is that the Scripture makes it clear that Jesus IS God, and IS the Son of God. He is the Word made Flesh, who died to atone for our sins, and who rose again to give us everlasting life. I'll leave you with a link below so you can do some study of your own. :)

  • Anonymous
    8 years ago

    1) Jesus was Jewish.

    2) In Judaism, ALL JEWS are considered to be the sons of God.

    3) Oh, well, duh! Now it all makes a lot more sense... the biggest misunderstanding in history.

  • 8 years ago

    Listen to Smell my gun smoke says, he speaks truth.

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