Anonymous asked in Society & CultureReligion & Spirituality · 9 years ago

Atheists: Explain the evolution of the universe with the 2nd law of thermodynamics.?

When this argument is usually presented, not a lot is known about it and so it is easily destroyed, however, this is because many creationists (and evolutionists alike) do not fully understand the argument.

The 2nd Law of thermodynamics (in a nutshell):

In a closed system, the overall entropy must increase over time.

Now, for those non scientists out there; entropy=chaos. So, this means that in a closed system, chaos must increase, and structure and order must decrease.

Most arguments involving this law of science say that evolution of life on earth is impossible because it involves order forming out of chaos. Now, this is easily destroyed by saying that the earth isn't a CLOSED SYSTEM, things get in and out of the earth, namely heat and light from the sun. So, it would appear that this argument is flawed because the law says that within a CLOSED SYSTEM, order cannot increase, and so evolution cannot occur (but the earth is not a CLOSED SYSTEM...).

So what is a closed system? - the earth? no. The universe?... Yes.

Since the universe is a CLOSED SYSTEM - nothing gets out or in - then the evolution of the cosmos is impossible (stellar evolution), because it would require order to be created out of chaos - which is impossible within the CLOSED SYSTEM of a universe - and so logically it follows the macro (normal) evolution is impossible too.

Atheists: how do you explain this?

Note - I probably went a little overboard with the whole 'CLOSED SYSTEM' thing, but it gets the point across.

15 Answers

  • Mia
    Lv 7
    9 years ago

    Its true that the universe will tend to become less organized over time if its a closed system. That doesn't mean in the interim with the influx of energy into particular systems within it there won't arise order. Its not permanent though. We know the earth will not last forever. As the sun dies out certainly it will eventually perish, thus eventually entropy wins. It doesn't mean though that on short term scales by the time line of the life of the universe order can't arise in a particular system due to the temporary influx of energy.

  • 9 years ago


    Yes, if we're talking information theory, it does. But you're talking about thermodynamics, which uses the term quite differently.

    In thermodynamics, entropy is the measure of energy within a system that is unable to be utilised to perform work. When energy dissapates as heat, that's an increase in entropy.

  • Anonymous
    9 years ago

    If you knew what you were spouting about, it might be interesting. However, you obviously don't.

    1) Entropy will win. Eventually, the universe will go completely dark.

    2) The time scale for the end of the universe is probably somewhere past 100 billion years from now.

    3) Before that, there will be localized effects that fit within the second law, but reverse the effect temporarily.

  • Strega
    Lv 7
    9 years ago

    You are assuming the universe is a closed system, you don't know that for sure.

    Our universe may receive energy from an outside source, such as other universes. Some have hypothesised there is an infinite number of universes, they can keep a universe such as ours going indefinitely. If one takes “universe” to mean everything that exists, (in other words the whole multiverse), then the idea is that it may contain infinite matter and energy, and never have to run down for this reason. It’s all a matter of perspective, and to some extent semantics.

    You have obviously made your argument fit around your already made conclusion. Why not actually look into scientific theories that may help you understand better. Claiming your are correct and that the universe is designed just because we may not have the answers is willfully ignorant.

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  • Qwerty
    Lv 5
    9 years ago

    The 2nd law of Thermodynamics is nothing to do with the evolution of universe. You are sewing the principle to irrelevant argument. The pressure , energy, heat equilibrium in Thermodynamics are not applicable to the universal law. Evolution is different topic which can't be applied in 2nd law of Thermodynamics.

    Source(s): Personal opinion.
  • ?
    Lv 7
    9 years ago

    So basically what you're saying is

    A. The Earth is not a closed system

    B. The Universe is a closed system

    C. The Earth is in the Universe therefore the Earth is a closed system

    See how stupid it looks now.

  • 9 years ago

    Evolution refers to the genetic changes over time in a population of organisms. The universe has no genetic code, does not reproduce, and has nothing to do with evolution.

  • Amanda
    Lv 4
    9 years ago

    Name all of the laws of thermodynamics, I'm willing to bet you dont know them, you heard this from a 'creationist' person or website and now spreading it around without doing your research or looking up the rest of the laws. If you dont understand it then dont talk about it like you do.

  • Anonymous
    9 years ago

    What you determine as ordered, and what you determined as chaotic is a flawed illusion of perception, relative to your perception, and is not an objective thing.

    As chaos increases, more order will be apparent.

  • 9 years ago

    It seems you got lost on your way to the Physics section. Let me help you.;_ylt=Asyp778lH2...

    In case you were looking for Biology instead, that section is located here;_ylt=AsJzAoDAOH...

    and if you ever need to have a question answered about outer space and the formation of the universe, this is the section for that purpose;_ylt=AsJzAoDAOH...

    While if you need to satisfy curiosities about earthly processes, most of those questions can be answered in Geology;_ylt=Askmar5FyY...

    Source(s): you're welcome
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