How do you find the real value of a car or van?

I am Looking out for a new van or car but I want to compare the value of them with at least 2 or 3 quotes of the actual value before profit is added on by the dealer or seller. I am sure no one sells at the real price, so how do you find the real price before profit so I can get a good start to haggle and barter... show more I am Looking out for a new van or car but I want to compare the value of them with at least 2 or 3 quotes of the actual value before profit is added on by the dealer or seller.
I am sure no one sells at the real price, so how do you find the real price before profit so I can get a good start to haggle and barter and see if the profit is reasonable.?
Is there any good websites out there that will give you the depreciation value?
Update: New Car, I meant Used Car....
Update 2: Used car
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