Do some people not understand the whole "Hero/Villain" dynamic?

I see constant, and I mean CONSTANT, whining about how much better WWE would be if John Cena turned heel. Could someone please explain to me who would replace him if that happened? You want to turn the biggest star in the entire industry heel, a guy who the VAST majority of fans really like (the IWC is not a large representation of most WWE fans), with no plan for what's next. You need a strong hero to take on great villains. (Also, I don't understand how anyone can say Cena right now isn't cool. He's been, by far, the best part of the Nexus angle)

Sure, there's Triple H, but Randy Orton isn't a face (cheers don't make a guy a face, nothing has changed in his actions in two years), Edge flopped colossally as a good guy, Jericho, Mysterio and Big Show aren't superstars (in the sense that Cena and Triple H are), Shawn Micheals is gone and CM Punk would need a long build to become a face again.

So I ask you, how would suddenly flipping Cena heel make any sense or benefit the WWE in any way?

BQ: What do you think of Cena's role in the whole Nexus thing? I really like it, but feel free to disagree. What about Bourne's? Do you like him as Cena's buddy?

Update:

BQ2: MITB: Are you excited for it? Do you think it looks strong? Which match are you most looking forward too?

***Um, to the first answerer, my picture of is of Jack and Kate from LOST

14 Answers

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  • 9 years ago
    Best Answer

    I have been trying to explain this very thing to this section for more than two years.

    If most fans find the heels more entertaining than the faces, that's fine; cheer for whoever you want. But the constant comments about this wrestler should turn heel, that wrestler should turn face makes it very evident that most people in the IWC do not understand the "hero" and "villain" roles and see pro wrestling as...a "writer" trying some ideas and the fans are the "focus group" to see which of those ideas they like. That's not how it works.

    We don't whine and complain about characters in novels, movies, and TV dramas, that one character should be the "good guy" when the author has cast him as the "bad guy", etc.

    The WWWF/WWF/WWE has a long history of having a "superman" character in the lead "role" of the company. A "hero" who "fights evil", "overcomes the odds", and always "comes back to win in the end". From Bruno Sammartino to Bob Backlund to Hulk Hogan to Ultimate Warrior to Bret Hart to Stone Cold Steve Austin to John Cena today. Hart and Austin weren't really "faces" but they were still put into that "hero" role by Vince McMahon.

    YOU CAN'T HAVE A STORY WITHOUT A HERO AND A VILLAIN!

    The "villain" is the bad guy, the one cheating, taking shortcuts, and doing every dirty trick he can think of to "get ahead" (in pro wrestling, that's the World Title), representing the "bad" in humans. The "hero" is the one "playing by the rules", "fighting fair", and "never cheating or taking shortcuts", representing the "good" in humans. You can't have villains without a strong hero.

    Since the fans' 180 flip in their booing and cheering habits, not just any old "hero" will work. In "modern times" the "hero" has to be stronger than the villains and be willing to "fight the good fight" for fans who now find the "virtuous good guy" boring. In the WWE, only John Cena can fit that role. Every other wrestler in the WWE has either, flip-flopped face/heel so many times he doesn't have the credibility to be the "hero", or he just doesn't have the "hero" qualities to begin with.

    I'm actually very surprised that other fans have not figured this out: the modern-day "hero" is not there to entertain you; he's there to foil the villains' evil schemes. Those oh-so-"cool" heels most fans seem to love these days are the ones entertaining you with their schemes and dirty tricks. In the WWE, without John Cena the "hero" foiling those evil schemes, "overcoming the odds",etc the villains would be boring. Classic example from last year: Randy Orton was given the ball to "carry" RAW as the WWE's top heel. He was given the WWE Title and RAW revolved around him. How long did that last before the IWC was sick of Orton and complaining about him and RAW ratings went down to the point that Vince got desperate and started that whole "guest host" thing?

    The WWE NEEDS Cena as the "hero".

    There is NOBODY else in the WWE who can assume that role should Cena turn heel.

    Randy Orton is not a face (and for the hundredth time: cheers do not determine face/heel status, ACTIONS DO!); he doesn't have the charisma, personality, and mic skills anyway. Triple H couldn't do it, either. Too many heel-turns and most fans seem to feel he only has a job because he's married to the boss' daughter. Jericho doesn't have the credibility to be the "hero" (and never had it). Big Show is physically too large and fans would see that as an unfair advantage. Undertaker only works half the year at best. None of the mid-card faces have the credibility yet to be a "hero" character. And the one time Vince DID try another star in the "hero" role, he was dragged through the mud and spit on by most fans (Jeff Hardy).

    Turning Cena heel would be the worst business decision the WWE has made in years. Whether you love him or you want to see him get beat, the stone cold fact is: millions of fans keep coming back to watch Cena as the "hero".

    BQ: Cena standing alone against Nexus is what's giving Nexus their credibility. If they were targeting any other wrestler, most of us wouldn't care about it that much. Vince understands the "hero" role in wrestling. And that's why Cena is standing between Nexus and Nexus "taking over" the WWE while the rest of the roster stand around twiddling their thumbs. Without Cena, the Nexus angle wouldn't be working as well as it has.

    BQ2: To be honest, I'm really not caring very much about MITB. The WWE is overdoing things like this lately, and there are more interesting things going on in other promotions.

  • 9 years ago

    Randy Orton is a face how can you say he is not? He gets the most cheers out of the whole roster and always faces heels. If Yawn Cena turns heel Randy could replace him easy and it would be soooo much better. Think about it all good things will happen to true wrestling fans. WWE will lose kids making it TV14 and we will see great matches again. When Cena turns heel I think he will finally do more than 5 moves since the fans won't cheer for him. I'm liking this Cena mainly because he is using weapons and making WWE more hardcore and at least he's not wrestling i'm glad to see that but he still has a main even title shot like 90% of the pay per views. They are pushing Evan Bourne and John Morrison so they will be new face main eventers. John Cena gets booed from any true fan anyway all so the only people that will actually lose is WWE for losing kids so they will lose their parents money.

    BQ: He's being more hardcore and I like that but I don't like him almost always making Nexus look weak. Bourne is finally getting the push he deserves. There has too be someone to like Cena.

    BQ2: Yes finally more good superstars will get pushed. It will be a good pay per view since most wrestlemania money in the banks were great now this pay per view has 2 so it will be good. Mostly the money in the bank matches.

    Hope that answered your question.

  • 9 years ago

    The people who say Cena would be better if he was a heel ARE DUMB. He would be better with a CHARACTER CHANGE. Infact, all Cena has to do is come up with more wrestling moves and book him so he does not just get beat down and then come back with the 5 moves he has. He would be a terrible heel because he is over with the majority of the main stream fans. Although, it would be pretty easy to make Randy Orton the main guy. He is getting much bigger pops than anyone else and deservedly so. Randy Orton is a fully fledged face. The other week there were a split down the middle of the locker room.. Faces on one side and heels on the other. If you do not see that he is face then you are blinded by his heelishness. Stone Cold didn't change his actions but are you seriously telling me that Stone Cold was not a face? Ha. I agree Edge was a terrible good guy and he is a born Heel and probably one of the best actors with his character. [including jericho, CM Punk and Kane] Mysterio and Big Show can not hold the company since they have been booked badly in the past or booked badly with the title. It is a true shame HBK has gone because he would be perfect in this Nexus role [heck, maybe he is the GM]. CM Punk is too established as a heel and can not be changed for another 3 years. With Punk he can be either but he outshines many others in the heel role and his gimmick is SO original that you can love him.

    Cena needs a new moveset along with narrowing down the cheesyness of his promos and he will be fine and I can finally begin to sit down and enjoy him for what he puts on. He is a good wrestler we just dont get to see it because of the way he is booked in matches. He is good at PPVs and I haven't seen a bad PPV of him since TLC09.

    BQ; I really don't like his role atm because he has abided by destroying each of the Nexus one by one. This is ******* ridiculous. I get that his character is to be noble and strong but he believes he can take 7 people out [which will probably happen and if it does I will actually stop watching until he is out of the title picture]. I liked his actions when he destroyed Darren Young but I do not approve of his actions for the future [killing off the NXT guys].

    Bournes is good because he is finally getting into the main event scene and that is all we can ask of WWE this far. Btw, thank Cena for Bournes push because he actually went to McMahon and told him he is wasting time by not pushing Bourne. I do like him as his buddy but I think their friendship should establish more and we really need to get more of an insight of Bournes personality and bonding Cena and Bourne would be a wise booking decision.

    I like the card. This PPV will either be amazing or terrible. I hate the MITB match having its own PPV because it has totally derailed of the power it had. It used to be something that was once a year and actually a GREAT opportunity but 8 guys for EACH brand.. then it is obvious who is going to compete for it because theres only 8 main guys on RAW and 8 main guys on SD. Keep it for WM. I am looking forward to the SD MITB the most because there are more potential winners since the show is basically full of midcard RAW guys. I think the most likely to win is either Christian or Matt Hardy. It will be great to see a HATRED feud between these two where they really despise each other.. [Christian as the heel] and then these two can become main eventers and run the show with the title [unfortunetly this will not happen even though these two get the biggest pops].

    Terrific question.

  • Anonymous
    9 years ago

    It seems as if, everyone wants Cena heel. I personally feel that Cena doesn't need to turn heel but if he does, so be it. The only reason many people want him to turn heel, is because he will go back to his rapping gimmick. They need to understand that's in the past and Cena has left that with the mic in the studio. He is more than likely finished after this new album coming out in a few months to years depending on how Cena feels, if he wants to make a new track, or mix the album up a little bit.

    It seems though, that he is going to turn heel. Randy Orton is moving into the spot of the face of the company. John Cena is slowly drifting away from that position. I do agree that cheers do not make Randy Orton face, but you can be a heel but at the same time, be the face of the company. Randy Orton will be moving into that position and Cena will be turning heel for a few reasons. The only reason they were keeping Cena heel is because of his sells. He has been the top seller over any other Superstar in the history of the company. Randy Orton is slowly talking that away and Vince is realizing that, Orton is his new "money maker."

    There have been rumors that he is turning heel along with a Triple H return and then turning him heel. WWE insiders want Triple H and John Cena to be the leaders of this NeXus angle as many inside wrestling sites report. I personally would love to see Cena and Triple H be the leaders of NeXus because it would spice up their character quite a bit.

    BQ:I like it in a way and I dislike it in a way. I seriously doubt Cena can get jumped by NeXus and then come back the next week. This had happened on the first week of the NeXus attack. I feel as if John Cena's "superman" type of character is running out of flavor and he needs that next thing to turn it up a notch. Evan Bourne's position as Cena's friend is alright. I couldn't disagree with WWE more by letting NeXus attack Evan Bourne after a match while he was supposedly injured. That was kind of pathetic on the part of the WWE. Also for NeXus scaring Sheamus like that is also pathetic. I thought Sheamus had the never back down celtic pride character who stood up for what he believed in. That wasn't the Sheamus that I've seen in the past 6 months. WWE needs to do a better job on tuning up their characters.

    BQ2:I'm excited for it but not so much. I believe the Money in the Bank ladder match should be contested at WrestleMania. It was a tradition and it shouldn't have been broken. I also do not like how there is 8 guys in each match. I perfer 6 superstars because the match isn't sloppy. With 8-10, you have guys who are laying out beside the ring who aren't involved. I'm looking foward to the SmackDown! Money in the Bank though. Hopefully Matt Hardy can finally win the World Championship that he deserves.

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  • Anonymous
    9 years ago

    Because the IWC thinks you're character is only interesting if you're heel, whether they want to admit it or not. They hated Batista as a face, but they glorify him as a heel. They bash HHH as a face but when he's heel they love him. They bash Randy Orton as a face, saying he's overrated but when he's heel he's underrated. And I would bet my whole house that if Cena turned heel all if his haters would turn into his marks, just like from 2003 when the regular fans booed Cena, the smarks cheered. And now that the casual fans are cheering, the smarks are booing.

    BQ: So far I like his role but the Nexus bores me, them doing the same thing gets stale after a while. I like Evan Bourne's push a lot and I think a lot of people are ruling him out of winning the RAW MITB.

    BQ2: It looks ok but I'll most likely watch online it doesn't look like something I'd spend my money on unless I got to it live. The match I'm looking forward to the most is the RAW MITB. I feel like anyone in the match can win (Except Henry & DiBiase)

  • 9 years ago

    It could bring back more attitude fans. As for his "replacement" for the face of WWE,

    If Bourne can win MITB, he can be the new face in just a few months or so. He seems capable of being able to be Cena's replacement. It all depends on whether he wins MITB, and how creative will build him up. But I say he can do it if everything goes perfectly.

    BQ: Cena's doing good in it. Bourne sticking with Cena can boost up his career that way.

    BQ2: I..guess? I still think they should have kept it as a Wrestlemania thing.. But lets see what they can do with a PPV. Hopefully we see some shockers and not just the usual. Looking forward to Smackdown's MITB. I like the picks better than RAW. RAW has all the same top stars on it.. Smackdown actually puts some new people in the matchup. For RAW, I hope Orton wins, and Smackdown, I hope Drew wins.

  • 9 years ago

    Like a lot of things in wrestling, the IWC refuses to pay attention to things like that. It's beneath their notice. But you are right. Cena makes waaaaay too much money for WWE to turn him heel, at least without a proper replacement. Right now, the only people who come anywhere near Cena's face status are the Undertaker, Rey Mysterio, and Triple H. They need Cena as a face. he is too important to their merchandise sale numbers.

    Either way, turning Cena heel won't make him better. It'll just allow WWE to give the fans a legit excuse to boo him, but it's not going to suddenly make him the greatest superstar overnight.

  • ill try not to write a long answer b/c some ppl above me pretty much said it all.

    No one can replace Cena, nearly everyone (including non-fans) know Cena. He is one of the most famous ppl in the world & WWE making him heel could impact ratings & what they've build him up to be. Cena should go all the way being a face. Him being heel is the LAST excuse for Cena haters.

    "Cena should be face b/c its more exciting", we dont know that, he's so good as a face, maybe him being a hell would mean a significant gimmick change, you cant be a superman Heel, it doesnt work, which means he basically starts from scratch. It will ruin him. Cena is good like he is. So yeah, alot of being dont understand the pros & CONS of a heel change.

    BQ: I enjoy Cena beating Nexus b/c they are pissing me off, but im enjoying it. I just wish theyd stop attacking ppl. Glad Cena is keeping them in place (somewhat)

    Bourne makes himsle look weak. He oversells moves & acts like he's dying so he should be the one helping Cena b/c he made himself look like a weakling. If they are looking for an underdog they should use Yoshi Tatsu.

    BQ2: I actually am looking forward to it, this is my most excited-ness?? being for a PPV this year, besides WM. Looking forward the most to these matches:

    -Alicia Fox v. Eve, maybe WWE will have a long good match btween my favorite diva & a good high-flying diva, b/c these 2 girls have alot of potential & could actually pull off a good match.

    - SD! MiTB, Matt Hardy gets his chance, @ WM my heart was pounding when he grabbed the breifcase, but Swagger ruined it. I want that feeling again, but I want it top actually end the way I wanted it too. Matt Hardy= Mr.MiTB

  • 4 years ago

    People either aren't aware that they are completely moronic, or they are being purposefully unintelligent and cruel... I vote for the latter, because 9 times out of 10, I could explain until I'm blue in the face and back it up with resources, and the jerks don't even have enough respect to use the proper pronouns... I mean, geeze, if you don't like it or don't want to believe it, fine, but at least be civil enough to humor me in my "delusions" and call me what I ask to be called! People just don't care about anyone else's wellbeing. That's the bottom line, gay OR straight or anything else, for the most part. They're content as long as you dress, speak, act and have sex in the ways they expect, but step out of those lines and suddenly you go from being a fellow human being to a "freak" and an "it". THAT is what's sick. We need to start treating one another as PEOPLE... NOT as walking, talking genitals. Aren't our brains, minds, SOULS more important than what we have between our legs, or does the world revolve around the Almighty Penis... or lack thereof? Uhg.

  • 9 years ago

    Theres always been alot of great answers, I will just say that business wise it would hurt the already troubled WWE, but for my personal reasons, it would be refreshing too see. Cena is a tad bit over-played these days, and rare heel turns have always been awesome. Even if it turned out short. But Business comes first these days, so it wouldn't happen.

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