Because the Messiah did not establish modern Israel, does that make Israel illegitimate?

The Messiah was supposed to have founded Israel. Because today's Israel was founded by the United Nations, does that make it an invalid Jewish state

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  • 1 decade ago
    Favorite Answer

    Nope, Israel currently isn't the Israel promised when the messiah comes & isn't meant to be that. It's that simple. It's secular democracy mean for political reasons to give Jews a safe place to be, a homeland & a place from which to defend themselves.

    One would assume the current Israel could more easily morph into the Israel that forms after the messianic age, more easily than if there was no Israel now. So to that extent the ideas are related.

    Jews don't consider it THAT Israel. It isn't run by Jewish religious law. (Many Muslim countries are run by Islamic law, but Israel is not.) It's also why all the claims of expansionism goals by Israel make no sense. No one Jewish thinks it's that Israel, nor that the messiah has come, & when he comes war won't happen, so it is not possible to have "expansionist" goals in Jewish theology. The only place they make sense is in classic antisemitic claims of how Jews plan to take over.

    This all assumes one more thing -- that the messanic concept is literally going to happen. In Judaism, some Jews believe it is a metaphoric age that will happen when we all work hard to bring peace to the world & an end to world suffering. Those same people don't care if Israel, as described, will ever form.

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  • 1 decade ago

    At worse it means the current Israel isn't the precursor of the Messianic age. That doesn't mean it isn't a legitimate Nation State. It's no more illegitimate than Jordan or Pakistan or India all of which were created Post World War 2 by a combination of British policy in divesting themselves of their Empire and International policy of trying to prevent wars breaking out between factions when the Brits pulled out. Are the nations built from these pieces by the Superpowers of the era all illegitimate? How far back do we have to go to find legitimacy? Should the US southwest be given back to Mexico? Should Mexico be returned to Spain or given over to the descendants of Aztecs? The Aztecs were fairly recent conquering overlords for most of Mexico. Should we find remenants of the earlier peoples to return the land to?

    Nation building has been going on from fiddling by the world powers for most the 19th and 20th centuries. The Maps of the World before that was filled with little city states, Rajaputs, Sultanates and European principalities that you've never heard of.

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  • Slick
    Lv 4
    1 decade ago

    Where do you think the Bible says that? Mine simply says God would do it, keeping an eternal promise to Abraham. The Messiah will come at a moment all hope is lost for modern day Israel, Jews on the run, pursued by armies of AntiChrist.

    The British won rights to "Palestine" in WWII, donated it to world Jews. The UN agreed. The Jews moved in and have defended their sovereignty ever since 1948, humiliating Arab challengers in the 6 Day War. Of course modern Israel is legitimate. No army has defeated them since they reoccupied with prophecies that would happen in the "last days". The Arabs have no historical promises or prophecies of ownership. For now they are formidable and a nuclear power, in their ancient homeland, and will stay put until God allows huge armies to overtake half of Jerusalem moments before Jesus returns to annihilate the enemies of Israel. Think about it. Military hand-to-hand combat on that scale sets missiles, bombs, and aircraft aside as practically useless because of the civilian population of both Jews and Arabs living in that area. Bayonets and swords will flash, bullets ripping. Old fashioned warfare at it's best. Israel wins.

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  • 1 decade ago

    No...In the first place, Israel is not 'illegimate' under Jewish law...it is simply not a religious state. There is no mitzvot that prohibits the foundation of a secular country between 70 AD and the Messianic Era. The foundation of Israel does not violate Judaism, just like Vatican City does not violate Christianity...simply because it is not Scriptural does not render it 'illegimate' according to our religion. I can't understand some anti-Israel people on this site---on the one hand, they criticize Israel by calling her a theocracy, on the other, they pretend that she should be judged according to religious criteria, and not secular ones.

    The mere fact that Israel is inhabited by Jews does not award other people the right to judge her by religious standards, and not secular standards applied to every other country.Zionism was a secular movement, Israel is a secular democracy. Even if she were not---do you think that the US should be judged by Christian standards (having a higher Christian percentage of the population than Israel has a Jewish percentage of hers), Shari'a States by Muslims standards, Bhuttan or Thailand should be judged by Buddhist standards, and India should be judged by Hindu standards? All those countries are judged in the international forum by abstract secular standards even though many identify themselves as states of a particular religion. If states that voluntarily call themselves "Muslim countries" or "Christian countries" or "Buddhist countries" derive their legitimacy from secular principles, secular Israel should be no different. Israel is not a religious state, and it never pretended to be so. It is legimate, because it is founded on principles that other legimate states have been founded on:

    --International recognition in a UN vote (this is true for many countries).

    --a successful war of independence (this is true of the US).

    --the longest unbroken connection to the land out of anyone (this is true of Irish nationalism, Basque nationalism, and other nationalist movements, many of which have formed countries).

    Peace

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  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    answer: No, the prophecy is that Israel would be reformed

    the Jewish Messiah will help re-establish the Temple once more.

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  • Jimbo
    Lv 7
    1 decade ago

    No, it simply means the Israel of today is not what the Messiah will make it when He comes again.

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  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    America was not founded by the messiah either!!

    Oh my god!! Americans are illegitimate!!

    See how silly posts like yours are now?!!

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  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    Israel is a nation again.

    Who are you to say that GOD(YHVH) and/or JESUS was not involved in that happening?

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  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    we are the new israel , the apostles were told to go and teach all nations and that is where the christian faith has come , throughout the world .

    even some of the jews are converting to christianity

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  • Ducks
    Lv 4
    1 decade ago

    That's what some claim.

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