im considering a Catholic Church but i need some answers from a knights of columbus person?
theres is this church where i live that ive been considering however it was built by the knights in 1500s..i have been thru the milss with churches and wondering and need the truth...when u r a knights of columbus do u do any kind of rituals to be a member? does Jesus come in the ritual before any of the charities.patriotsim..What im asking is that when u make the oath is the oath to the Father? and it is in the speach just like that?
kc=maybe ur branch but im saying this is written in stone infront of their building..1500s knights of columbus
yes, i know im a women but i dont want a church that is committed to fraternity more than Father..so i need to be careful
John- not sure i like the bone thing..lol but i like your answer..just wondering if they are putting Father first then why secret? i do like your answer
- 1 decade agoFavorite Answer
From an catholic upbringing.
To some catholics religion is a private thing not to be discussed.
I dont know but I do know that the jesuits when they commited to it said this oath.
Q.:- Go ye, then, into all the world and take possession of all lands in the name of the Pope. He who will not accept him as the Vicar of Jesus and his Vice-regent on earth, let him be accursed and exterminated."
The Oath of the Knights of Columbus, Knights of Malta and Rhodes Scholars is based upon the Oath of the Jesuits
(This is an extract of the Congressional Record of the House of Representatives dated February 15, 1913, where the oath is entered as purported to be of the Knights of Columbus).
"I, ............, now in the presence of Almighty God, the blessed Virgin Mary, the blessed St. John the Baptist, the Holy Apostles, St. Peter and St. Paul, and all the saints, sacred host of heaven, and to you, my Ghostly Father, the superior general of the Society of Jesus rounded by St. Ignatius Loyola, in the pontification of Paul the III and continued to the present, do by the womb at the Virgin, the matrix of God, and the rod of Jesus Christ, declare and swear that His Holiness the Pope, is Christ's vice regent and is the true and only head of the Catholic or Universal Church throughout the earth; and that by virtue of the keys of binding and loosing given His Holiness by my Savior, Jesus Christ, he hath power to depose heretical kings, princes, States, Commonwealths, and Governments and they may be safely destroyed. Therefore to the utmost of ray power I will defend this doctrine and His Holiness's right and custom against all usurpers of the heretical or Protestant authority whatever, especially the Lutheran Church of Germany, Holland, Denmark, Sweden, and Norway and the now pretended authority and Churches of England and Scotland, and the branches of same now established in Ireland and on the Continent of America and elsewhere, and all adherents in regard that they may be usurped and heretical, opposing the sacred Mother Church of Rome."
"I do now denounce and disown any allegiance as due to any heretical king, prince, or State, named Protestant or Liberals, or obedience to any of their laws, magistrates, or officers."
"I do further declare that the doctrine of the Churches of England and Scotland, of the Calvinists, Huguenots, and others of the name of Protestants or Masons to be damnable, and they themselves to be damned who will not forsake the same."
"I do further declare that I will help assist, and advise all or any of His Holiness's agents, in any place where I should be, in Switzerland, Germany, Holland, Ireland, or America, or in any other kingdom or territory I shall come to and do my utmost to extirpate the heretical Protestant or Masonic doctrines and to destroy all their pretended powers, legal or otherwise."
"I do further promise and declare that, notwithstanding I am dispensed with to assume any religion heretical for the propagation of the Mother Church's interest to keep secret and private all her agents' counsels from time to time, as they intrust me and not divulge, directly or indirectly, by word, writing, or circumstances whatever but to execute all that should be proposed, given in charge or discovered unto me by you my Ghostly Father, or any of this sacred order."
"I do further promise and declare that I will have no opinion or will of my own or any mental reservation whatsoever, even as a corpse or cadaver (perinde ac cadaver), but will unhesitatingly obey each and every command that I may receive from my superiors in the militia of the Pope and of Jesus Christ."
"That I will go to any part of the world whithersoever I may be sent, to the frozen regions north, jungles of India, to the centers of civilization of Europe, or to the wild haunts of the barbarous savages of America without murmuring or repining, and will be submissive in all things whatsoever is communicated to me."
"I do further promise and declare that I will, when opportunity presents, make and wage relentless war, secretly and openly against all heretics, Protestants and Masons, as I am directed to do to extirpate them from the face of the whole earth; and that I will spare neither age, sex, or condition, and that will hang, bum, waste, boil, flay, strangle, and bury alive these infamous heretics; rip up the stomachs and wombs of their women, and crush their infants' heads against the wails in order to annihilate their execrable race. That when the same can not be done openly, I will secretly use the poisonous cup, the strangulation cord, the steel of the poniard, or the leaden bullet, regardless of the honor, rank, dignity, or authority of the persons, whatever may be their condition in life, either public or private, as I at any time may be directed so to do by any agents of the Pope or superior of the Brotherhood of the Holy Father of the Society of Jesus."
- kcchaplainLv 41 decade ago
The Knights of Columbus was founded by Father Michael J. McGivney in Connecticut in 1882, so there is no chance that they built the church of which you speak. The Knights of Columbus is a fraternal benefit society for Catholic gentlemen. Knights make a promise not to reveal any details of the initiation ceremony.
EDIT: Maybe the number is the number of the council (not "lodge"), but there were no Knights of Columbus in the 1500's.
Why don't you go and talk to the priest at the Church? He should be able to answer any questions you might have.
Good answer, John S.
The reason for the secrecy is simple. The secrecy applies only to the initiation ceremonies, and the reason that we keep it secret is so that the ceremonies themselves will have the maximum effect on new candidates. Just like with anything else, the effect is diminished on someone who knows what to expect. (For instance, if you were going to see a movie that I had seen already, you wouldn't want me to spoil it for you by telling you the ending.)
The Knights of Columbus are totally committed to God and His Holy Church. Take a look at the website if you want more information about them.
God's Dark Italian Princess: I can't speak for what the Knights of Columbus were doing in 1913. I wasn't around then. However, I have been a member of the Knights of Columbus for twenty years, and I have never seen nor heard that oath at any KC function, least of all, at an initiation. I certainly never took any such oath myself.Source(s): Member of the Knights of Columbus http://www.kofc.org/un/eb/en/about/index.html
- 4 years ago
Yes, the KoC was created to compete with other fraternal groups. The strange ritual you're describing is absolutely NOTHING like a Masonic initiation. NOTES: A Catholic can ABSOLUTELY be a member of the fraternity; this was changed in 1983, when Canon 1374 ("One who joins an association which plots against the Church is to be punished with a just penalty; one who promotes or moderates such an association, however, is to be punished with an interdict") replaced Canon 2335 ("Those who join a Masonic sect or other societies of the same sort, which plot against the Church or against legitimate civil authority, incur ipso facto an excommunication simply reserved to the Holy See."). Some will say that the OPINION letter issued by the Office of the Inquisition (now called "Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith") trumps Canon Law, however they're incorrect. An opinion doesn't supercede the Canon Law that ALL Catholics are required to live by. - Nor is there ANY "universal belief" in Freemasonry that says that "all religions are equal." That is an untruth perpetuated by Christians (not just Catholics). Freemasons generally believe that a man's religion is his own. We do not talk about religion (or politics, for that matter) in Lodge. That tends to irk some of the Weekend Christian Warriors who believe that they're to testify to every person they meet and convert them from one perfectly good religion to their wacky religion. - Per Canon Law, a Catholic who is also a Freemason may receive the sacraments of the Church. There is absolutely no rule against it - regardless of what some well-meaning but ridiculously misinformed KoC dudes my say. I received the Sacraments today, in fact. And I plan on going to Church again (like I do every week) and receive them on Easter Sunday as well. - It is unfortunate that SOME Catholics do not understand their own religion, and insist on spreading lies about Freemasonry - a fraternity that they CLEARLY know nothing about. Freemasons don't spread lies about the Church. Guess that makes us better Catholics.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
The Knights of Columbus have their members-only rituals that they perform, as to virtually all lodges (Freemasons, college fraternities, Elks club, etc.).
I have no idea what their initiation oath is, but considering that they're a Catholic-based lodge, I imagine it includes some religious trappings in addition to loyalty to the lodge itself.
Though as others have pointed out, you're not a male, so you can't join the K of C anyway. Though if you want to support the unpatriotic group that pressured the government into inserting the words "under God" into the pledge back in the 1950s, go right ahead.
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- KarenitaLv 61 decade ago
i'm not a member of the Knights of Columbus but I do want to point out that the KofC is for men only. Try to see if the Church you're thinking of attending has a Legion of Mary chapter.
- John SLv 71 decade ago
KofC is for men, as others are saying. They are a faternal organization which the Church holds in high regard, BUT is separate from the church. They do not decide doctrines or have any say in how the church runs. They are similar to Catholic Charities International. - A separate organization.
Their process to join is partly public and partly private. As a faternity, they guard the private part of the ceremony, so that it retains the significance and impact of it. Each member is told NOT to reveal the private part of the ceremony to anyone who is not a knight...that way it stays special.
My Dad was a knight.. I guess technically still is, but kinda stopped going (no reason really, just lazy I guess) and he won't tell me what goes on..BUT I know a fake bone is part of it, because I saw it at our house and he said it was for the initiation ceremony.
He basically told me it has to do with swearing allegiance to defend God and the weak.
The KofC is a charitable organization first started to take care of the widows of the men killed in wars. They are a HUGE multi billion dollar Insurance company now with a A+ credit rating. They provide life insurance to people all over the world.
Just this year, during Mass, a druggy off the street came in and started to shove a person at the front of he church as they got out of their seat to go to communion. Totally random..just walked up the center aisle and started shoving the guy.
2 Knights of Columbus who happen to be ex-police officers, immediately got up, and without a word, put him in a submissive hold and walked him out the back of the church.
Only time I've ever seen that happen in a catholic church..but I was glad they were there, as I don't know the first thing about how to subdue and escort a person on drugs out of the church. It is not that everyone sat idle simply expecting "the Knights" to take care of this.. NO, I only found out they were knights and ex-policemen AFTER church. I was in the process of getting out of my seat and getting involved when I saw 2 guys walk up and ::BAM!:: in like 1.5 seconds had the guy in an arm lock and was walking him out of the church.
So I not saying the KofC are "enforcers" or "security" just that this was an instance where they took their vows seriously and helped out the weak and endangered (sadly myself included)
If they hadn't stepped in, I don't know WHAT I would have done, if I was the only guy to respond, as I don't know HOW to subdue a person who doesn't want to cooperate.
ahhh... I see your question.
Is the KofC some pseudo Mason-like group who is secretly into weird stuff and acultic practices. Like in the Davinci Code or one of Dan Brown's books...
NO. They are a charitable organization dedicated FIRST to God, because they are Catholics FIRST but beyond that..they are Catholics who have taken additional oaths and try to do good things.
But as Catholics first..they are of course, dedicated to living Christian lives and following God.
Here's a way of thinking about it...
Catholic who happens to be KofC
KofC who happens to be Catholic.
Get the difference?
The fact that the KofC built the church does not mean it is a place to WORSHIP the Knights of Columbus. That would be like saying.. if Smith Construction company built the church.. the church holds Smith Bros. above God. NO, the Smith Bros. are just the ones who built it or paid for it.
Don't worry about who BUILT the building or paid for it.
- skepsisLv 71 decade ago
All the KCs I know are very religious. I seriously doubt that they have any nefarious pledges, no matter how secret. However, those St. Vincent de Paul types, they seem to spend as much time helping needy people as praying. I'd keep an eye on them.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Just be calm, confident, and everything will turn out fine. It's not like they are going to hurt you.