Alarmists: If it could be demonstrated that a much-warmer earth is safe, would you be less hysterical?
How would it affect your shrieking doom-saying if it could be conclusively shown that much higher global temperatures and a complete lack of landlocked ice still yields an Earth that is completely amenable to life?
There it is. The continents are in roughly their same modern configuration. No polar ice. No landlocked ice. Life moves and breathes and will for millions of years. Note that this temperature was achieved without the touch of human beings. This is the late Cretaceous period of history and it happened right here on planet Earth.
Will you stop screeching so loud, and think about this?
Some preemptive considerations:
-most atmospheric carbon comes from organic matter decay, not from human activities.
-the main greenhouse gas is water vapor, by an overwhelming percentage. Pretending carbon is a massive part of this mix is disingenuous and irresponsible.
-over 31,000 scientists have sued Al Gore over his claim of a global scientific consensus. These are not necessarily climate scientists, just some of the many scientifically-trained persons who are disgusted at the lack of objective discussion and the attempted silencing of debate from the man-made global warming alarmist crowd. As Michael Crichton said, if there is a consensus, it is not science.
Mr N, upon searching it appears that the lawsuit of a year ago didn't go ahead. I did find this on YouTube about John Coleman talking about his desire to bring the suit (last year): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfoNct-kfqw
Gwens, did you miss the part about dinosaurs wandering around? Mammals survived the extinction event which wiped out the dinosaurs. If there is life on earth, it is as safe as it needs to be.
Gwens, it's not fantasy. It was a reality on this planet. It was even warmer during the Paleocene.
Dawei, I agree with you. We will be able to adapt and survive. We have a big edge over most creatures to do so. That means that the earth is safe. (If "safe" has any meaning--being alive means you are going to die. :P )
All of these extreme temperature changes and massive shifts in climate went on without human activity.
The only thing that is sure about the climate is that it will change. It always is, it always has, always will. The point of bringing up the late Cretaceous and the Paleocene (might as well throw in the ice ages as well), is that the climate of this planet is going to change radically, without human intervention. We will have to adapt when the climate changes. Leveling all kinds of heavy-handed rhetoric against eachother isn't going to alter the climate change one way or another. Passing laws will only interfere with human freedoms, not affect global weather.
Now we can and will flourish, whatever the planet throws at us, as Dawei says. Civilization does not need to grind to a halt. I am not antagonistic to safeguarding ourselves, but as I see it the greatest danger to humans now and always has been other humans. And one side of this debate is on the attack.
- dirocynLv 51 decade agoFavorite Answer
I've been saying this for a while. 4-5 degrees of warming won't hurt me a bit, except to increase my power bill in the summer. I'll survive. Heck, I'll probably be able to grow avocadoes here in Tennessee. Which will be a good thing 'cause they won't have the water to grow 'em in California.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Like an old comfortable shoe, this topic has run through my fingers and keyboard so many times now, that I'm surprised that I again feel compelled to address the issue yet again. All too often, I hear folks discussing the weather, and leaping to astounding and absurd conclusions about "global warming".
The truth is, I can understand the confusion. While the talking heads jabber and issue proclamations about "global warming", my neighbors are just now cleaning up after a dog gone long hard winter that delivered some absolutely stinking cold days. It's tough to sell someone on the idea that our planet is warming up.
We all hear stories about the polar regions apparently undergoing substantial warming, with odd and sometimes alarming news coming from both the arctic and antarctic regions. World wide, alpine glaciers are going to h*## in a hand basket. The ice up high, and in the polar regions is telling us that it's too warm to conduct business as ice, but in many places where people live, the weather isn't getting warmer and nicer. Instead, some spots seem to be growing cooler. Many places are experiencing way nastier weather than previous generations haver ever seen as 100+ year old records fall like flies. In some places, it really is heating up, but the rains or the tornadoes, or the dust storms are getting so out of hand that it's just no fun anymore. The weather is tearing is up. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to understand that agriculture is at stake world wide.
So, just what the dickens is going on?
Well it's not too complicated actually, and the science behind the idea is sound. We really are changing the global climate as we charge the atmosphere with huge amounts of energy. Sadly, that does not immediately equate to extra "heat"as we commonly regard it. You can stand around and watch the thermometer as long as you want, and over the period of a life time you'll probably see it creep ever upwards, but you'll be way more impressed much sooner by that storm that just put your chicken coop in your neighbors tree, or the rains that washed out a 150 year old bridge, of that blizzard in late May that pinned you down just when your wife had to deliver a child.
This process is adding energy to the atmosphere. That means it's going to get pretty feisty. It can dissolve way more water and carry it a lot farther that it did before. It can suspend more things in the air for longer periods of time and carry it's load much farther. It can move more stuff faster over longer distances than before. It stirs the oceans with more vigor and gives up energy to them.
It's a change from the relative stability we have enjoyed for some time now. It is unstable. It is searching for a new, "more comfortable" higher energy configuration that the one we grew up with. Eventually it will settle down in new digs, with a more energetic ocean and atmosphere stirred up to some new speed we haven't seen before. Nobody knows for sure what that will look like, but we can probably kiss our industrialized civilization goodbye. Bye bye!
So the next time you hear about "global warming", think about a bunch of kids on sugar. Things are getting more rambunctious. They're not called gas LAWS for no reason.
Global warming was a poor choice of words.
Funny thing though, the heat is on.
lcSource(s): chemistry texts, physics texts, meteorology texts, geology texts, etc.
- DavidLv 61 decade ago
No one is saying that global warming will wipe out life on Earth. That is not the danger here. Of course if life survived ice ages and meteor impacts, it can survive a few degrees of warming.
What you're failing to recognize though, is that although the Earth has had many catastrophic events and survived, the Earth of the past billion or so years was vastly different than the Earth of the past 200 or so years. That is, simply, that human beings now inhabit it.
Humanity survived the last ice age, but their numbers were small and we were still nomadic, wandering around and changing continents on a whim. We can't do the same today.
The ice ages were only about 5-6 degrees cooler than today, and the climate was completely different. A similarly drastic change in the climate could occur in a world that is 5-6 degrees warmer, or less (we are already about at the max of what Earth is typically used to.)
Where will this leave humanity? We cannot simply walk to another place anymore. Our numbers are now in the billions instead of the thousands, we depend on stable and massive scale agriculture, not hunting and gathering. We live in highly developed cities, not caves. Every aspect of our lives is very much adapted to this specific climate.
If the climate changes, we will be forced to adapt. We will be able to, but it would mean a heck of a lot of hardship for humanity. Entire cities and nations could be at risk due to sea level, agricultural regions could turn to desert, oceans could acidify causing millions to starve, floods and droughts could compromise health...the list goes on.
Global warming is not significant because of its impacts on nature. Nature will always be fine. It is significant because of its impacts on humanity.Source(s): http://www.bbc.co.uk/climate/impact/ http://www.ipcc.ch/pdf/assessment-report/ar4/wg2/a... http://newscenter.lbl.gov/feature-stories/2008/09/... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_global_war... But kiah, just because we may be able to adapt doesn't mean we have nothign to worry about. Again, the 'alarmists' are not worrying about the extinction of humanity, but that the development of our civilization may be hindered quite a bit. That serious damage to our economy and overall well being could be encountered. Something shouldn't have to mean the end of life as we know it before it can be considered a serious problem, wouldn't you agree? The hardship and devastation that could potentially occur is a preventable scenario. Yes reducing emissions is risky and costly, but the cost benefit analyses have been done. Doing nothing is much more costly and dangerous. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_global_w...
- 4 years ago
Global Warming has done what Hitler and the Nazi's could not. What Stalin and the Commies could not. It has destroyed the US! Just think of all the Jobs lost overseas due to this farce called Global Warming. How many Jobs were lost overseas because the US Government wasn't taxing businesses enough or regulating them enough? How many lost because the Labor Unions simply weren't asking for a big enough share of the profits?
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- Author UnknownLv 61 decade ago
So start demonstrating that a much-warmer earth is safe. So far you have nothing.
And no, the continents are not roughly in their same modern configuration.
edit: What in your little fantasy earth would be the human carrying capacity? Where would the food grow after the tropical belts expand due to increased atmospheric energy. Where do we get water for irrigation after the glaciers melt. How many people starve to death before the earth is safe again? Will there be a nuclear exchange when water in Indus valley can no long support food production for two countries?
edit2: The fantasy world I'm referring to is the one where you believe all is well under AGW
- Anonymous1 decade ago
The event that wiped out the dinosaurs wiped out all large animals. People are large enough to be wiped out by that type of event.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Safe, except for all the flooded cites and mass migrations to the interior. Where will those people live? Will be a boon for the housing industry, if you can afford the land and materials. Going to need new ports for commerce, because all the existing ones are flooded.
I'm guessing you didn't quite think this one through!
- NLBNLBLv 61 decade ago
Can you provide a link to the (long debunked) LAWSUIT against mr AG (I do not even want to name him)
- JOHNNIE BLv 71 decade ago
Sorry but I do not think there is anything to educate them to the truth.
- 1 decade ago
yes. but it's not going to make the earth safer.