Do most atheists believe in Jewish superiority?
I've been struck lately by an odd similarity between the attitudes of fundamentalists and atheists regarding jewish people. Most atheists are in my experience urbanized liberals so it seems odd that they would subscribe to what might be called a secularized version of the fundie/ jewish belief in Jews as intrinsically superior. A lot of atheists rave about them ( superior intelligence,etc.) after a fashion strikingly similar to fundies,but without of course the religious gloss. How does this translate politically? After all,almost all Jews are pro-zionist,yet the left is anti-zionist to varying degrees. Opinions?
O.k.,I'm talking about attitudes like mesing9's. he thinks they unsually well-educated,really smart about their religion,etc. That's the attitude. How does it differ in effect from the fundie attitude of a chosen people? It still incorporates the same basic idea of superiority. Incidentally,most atheist are liberal and urban; it's been studied. I didn't all. I said most. And in my experience they do believe that jews have all kinds of superior attributes.
Meg,an excellent point,however unwelcome to most respondents. I've noticed that myself.
Misty Blue - yes,as a rule a leftist is more like than not to be agnostic. However my point is that liberal-left types - which includes most atheists - frequently express the view that Jews are unusally gifted in all sorts of ways; i.e. superior - and that does constitute a secular version of the fundie super-race concept.
- Anonymous1 decade agoBest Answer
It doesn't sound like anybody got the point of your question; in fact,it looks like they just glanced at a few phrases before answering. Anyway,here's my answer as a college boy for what it's worth.
1) Most Jewish people are pro-Israeli; it's nonsense to suggest otherwise. That is pro-Zionism. Most fundamentalists are pro-Zionist.
2) Most fundamentalist do - for religious reasons - regard jewish people as superior to the rest of humanity; i.e. "God's chosen people".
3) Most urban liberals - and I grew up in an urban liberal environment and exist in one ( college) now,do indeed subscribe to the view that Jewish people are unusually intelligent,gifted and are therefore - not in so many words - basically a superior people.
4) Such an attitude as the above does seem to constitute a secular version of the chosen people construct.
5) Most atheists that I have known do indeed subscribe to political and cultural views associated with the urban liberal,irregardless of where they live.
6) They are not able to fully justify their exaltation of Jewish people other than to shrug and mention Einstein.
7) Athiests and/or urban liberals are very conflicted about Israel precisely because they venerate jews but being somewhat to the left they do look askance at Isael's human-rights record,which is not a good one.
That's my contribution. As to why this exaggerated opinion of Jews is there - it does smack of reverse-racism - I can offer no speculation.
Anyway,at least I understood the question. I hope. It didn't look tough to understand to me,what to speak of my amazement at the garbled and uncomprehending responses. Actually,it could have made for a interesting online discussion. But you'd need people who read questions before they answer them.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
I believe in everyone's superiority and in nobody's superiority.
Some Jews think that they are "the chosen ones" and might display an arrogant attitude towards other groups.
The Holocaust is the foundation of the state of Israel; the manipulation of the Media after the end of WWII gave the Jew
the opportunity to advertize the plight of the race in face of extermination. The result was a profound sympathy for the Jews by the rest of the world and paved the way for the immoral creation of the state of Israel in occupied Palestine; and England and the USA were partners in crime.
I, as an Atheist, believe in justice and compassion towards everyone, regardless of race or religion, and that was not what happened in Palestine. If superiority is measured by the size of one's gun then I have to say that the Jews are militarily superior to the Palestinians; but ethically they are not.
- m iLv 51 decade ago
I've never heard a liberal-leftist say that Jews are intrinsically superior.
Speaking as an atheist, I have no clue where you get that idea. This hang up on superior intelligence is part of the anti-intellectual right-wing American culture.
Most of the "left" leadership, i.e. in the democratic party is pro-Zionist.
The good news for all the stupid people out there is that you can get smarter by studying hard. The bad news is that if you study propaganda, lies and creation "science" and religious myths as facts, you'll be just as ignorant regardless of how hard you study. Even very smart people sometimes completely believe things that have no basis in fact.
- 1 decade ago
well, Stalin was a Jesuit in training, became atheist, and persecuted Jews. Was that because he was atheist or because he had a Christian background? I think its interesting to consider, Christians used to kill Jews regularly, now they love Jews and kill Arabs regularly. A long time ago they killed both with abandon. Muslims used to tolerate Jews but made them ride their donkeys backwards, it wasnt until this century things switched around cuz the Jews got tough again like they were (supposedly) a long time ago. Guess it depends on if you believe the bible in a historical sense, I dont, but its interesting again that Christians, Jews, and Muslims all believe in the same God, they just have differing attitudes about who god loves best. Daddy loves me best, no daddy loves me best, no you ba***rd, daddy loves me best, oh yeah, Ill kill you!!! I think Jews emphasized education for centuries because it was moveable while property assets were regularly confiscated any time there was a pogram, it may be a liberal view that this is still so, but I dont think so, as a whole I dont think they subscribe to more interest in education than anyone else anymore. I was a communist radical for years, and an atheist, I was suprised many Jews were leftist Marxists etc...., considering the prejudice in those circles against them. Contrary perhaps to Stalin, I am now an Independent Catholic Bishop, having moved in the opposite direction than he, but I think Jews are the same as anyone else, its our attitudes that change. I do find it interesting that Islamic peoples in general ( if we're generalizing) still seem to live in the middle ages culturally because they eschew education for their women. Dont they still stone them too? Or do honor killing if they scr*w the wrong guy?Personally I think when we quit thinking and debating about Jews, Arabs, Christians, etc...and just discuss humans, we will move ahead a little. We are all just people, and the sooner we all recognize that and stop categorizing people the better off we will all be.
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- MagusLv 41 decade ago
First i disagree that almost all Jews are Zionists.
Why may you ask...
The older generation does but studies of the younger generation has shown that their ties to the homeland as the older generation has is disappearing...
I think fundamentally those that are told from birth to strive for the Golden Ring of education and success and the support of the whole drives most of them. E.G. A friend I know describes it this way. His Synagogueue Lends money out three times to any individual to start a business if they lose it 3 times they are cut off. Also they support any-ones education out of a fund. Families leave money from their estates to the Synagog beating death taxes etc and that money is available to the family of the deceased.
How many other groups religions etc work together and do this.
When you have a group that is so successful in all aspects of the economy and business (Medicine, law, the entertainment business etc) you get- influence, donations, undo jealousy but again the perception of a particular group being so dominant in their fields gives those of a liberal sphere (who are usually more educated and a little more open minded) tend to demagogue those that excel.
Whereas the conservative majority are the god fearing closed minded types do not. So not superior but a group that does better then others because of a need to be the best at what they do in the worship of money...
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Are there really Atheists out there who consider themselves intellectually superior? I'm not like that at all, I got into Atheism to become more open to peoples views and to respect people because I wouldn't have religion to bias my opinions (that and I don't beleive in an omnicient being that controls all of our lives). Anyway, I feel that all are equal in this world no matter who you are, so Jews aren't any higher on my list of people to respect than a hobo or a celebrity is.
- Misty BlueLv 71 decade ago
As a person with no need for a crutch and no need to judge others I'd have to say the thought never entered my head.Each to their own I say.One question though and I may have misinterpreted,would I be right in thinking that you think lefties are more likely to be godless?
One further point.When I was younger I worked for a number of Jewish folk and had Jewish friends.They were the same mixed bag of types as you find in any religion or group and I don't recall at any time thinking they thought themselves superior nor did I think they had a superiority about them lacking in others.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
This is too much of a generalization. Jews tend to appreciate the benefits of education far more than fundie Christians, I think most people would agree with that. However, I am very anti Israel, and overall I think Israelis are self serving, asshats. But thats a different kettle of fish.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Of course not, the first part of the bible was written as a way to control the jewish people in thinking there is a messiah coming, it also willed them to kill various Arabic tribes "because God says so", in addition filled them with this lie that they are better then everyone else, and they and many Christian believe this to be true, its all just a money and military scam of ancient Israelites.
It angry me that anyone can go against politics and the world because they wrote down their version of "God's Will", I'm sure he didn't tell them to do what they did, and what they are still doing, if he is all he is suppose to be.
Note: Anyone who says oh we just appreciate education more, is a way of saying were smart intellectual and to say something only shows what we Maya is meaning
- gavillaLv 43 years ago
American conservatives are vigorously professional-Israel (and Wolfowitz et al are all Zionist to a guy) because of the fact the beginning of Israel represents the closest any of them have ever have been given to seeing a biblical prophesy come authentic. it is nonetheless the fundies' accountability to transform Jews to Jesus nevertheless. American neo-con Jews take exhilaration in the political muscle that having a US president friendly in the direction of Israel provides them. And boy, do you supply Israel some political muscle! And given the stability of skill interior the middle East, what available marvel ought to it is that the neo-cons, Christian and Jewish, favour Israeli could over the transforming into impression of Arab and Islamic peoples of their very own lands? they have shared political, financial and non secular pastimes. Why isn't this obtrusive?