This remark by Cassius with regards to rape:?
I thinks he has a point. The best we can do is to discourage false accusations by severly punishing them (if it turned out the "victim" lied). Only when the rate of false accusations drop more girls will come forwards and report the crime.
He says when the false accusations drop more girls (who have been raped) will come forward. This must mean that many girls now are afraid to report the crime so this must mean that the rape statistics are far higher then really reported. This is disturbing to me. Please comment. Do you think then that the statistics do not clearly show how this crime is being minimized and trivialized by the likes of Cassius?
oops almost forgot the link so this might be proven
another interesting link which once again proves him wrong, wrong ,wrong
- wendy gLv 71 decade agoFavorite Answer
Claiming that 95% of rape claims are false is EXTREMELY denigrating and insulting to rape victims. I am personally offended and disgusted by his trivialization of rape, AND the self-righteous, condescending way in which he did it. And then he couldn't even back his claim up. By the way, I've seen this statistic before, posted by other "Cassius" types here in Women's Studies, and it was on a web site that also claimed that the Holocaust was a "hoax", and that African-Americans should be rounded up and sent back to Africa. No wonder he didn't want to post a real link.
BTW, the FBI reports false rape claims to be closer to 8%.
EDIT--Cassius, look at your last post. I SAID 8%, the statistics given by the FBI. I NEVER said 2-3%, so stop putting words in my mouth. Are you intentionally lying now (or maybe again?) or are you just that stupid? No offense...I'm genuinely curious, I would like to know. I have my own ideas...
And I don't have my "thinking mixed up"...you have made a HIGHLY offensive claim, and failed to back it up with any credible source. How many times do I have to say it? To suggest that ALMOST ALL WOMEN WHO COME FORWARD TO REPORT RAPE ARE "LYING", IS OFFENSIVE...how can you NOT SEE THAT? You haven't given us one shred of supporting evidence, you expect us to believe this blindly? If YOU "read" this somewhere, and just believed it unquestioningly, THEN YOU ARE A GULLIBLE FOOL AT BEST...and a disgusting misogynist at worst.
Oh, and my "girlfriend"??!!! Well, there it is...typical misogynist response. Not winning an argument? Getting your little floral print panties in a wad? Well, then, just call the woman a lesbian and PRESTO! instant vindication! Do you feel better now? You are just showing yourself to be the cowardly, woman-hating idiot you are.
And I'm not "lying" about your (supposed) source. I'VE NEVER SEEN IT, REMEMBER? I just said that I HAVE seen that statistic elsewhere, and it was a site that also suggested the Holocaust was a "hoax." That a web site like that would post your "statistic" shows how credible it is...again I don't know WHERE you got it from, you never provided a source. Can't you read? I understand this is not your native language (it couldn't be more obvious) but maybe that's part of the problem. You should really give it up.
EDIT--Cassius-When have I ever called anyone gay? Evidence please (you know, the thing your posts always lack?) Otherwise, keep your lies in the form of "questions."
EDIT--Happy, what IS that web site you posted...some sort of mystical "swami" site? Who happened to be accused of sexual misconduct...so HE doesn't have any reason to dig up Kanin's study, does he? And every "claim" that you regurgitate from that "source" (that lacks an ounce of credibility) does not provide a link or source for it's infomation. COMPLETELY MADE UP LIES FROM A SOURCE THAT HAS NO CREDIBILITY WHATSOEVER.
MISOGYNIST LIES DEBUNKED.
And, Kanin HIMSELF has said that his study cannot be extrapolated to other populations, he states "Certainly our intent is not to suggest that the 41% incidence found here be extrapolated to other populations, particularly in light of our ignorance in regard to structural variable." Again, the FBI says 8%, they are the more credible than any other source, in my opinion.
As for DNA stats, you cannot claim that just because the cops got the wrong guy, that the woman lied about being raped in the first place. She may not have seen her attackers face, she may have only gotten a general impression of him, she may have been to traumatized, etc. But then you know this...(deja vu?).
And my website says 8%...and you have not now, or EVER, "caught me lying". Post the responses where you "caught me"...I guarantee you won't, because you know that in every post it is YOU who have been caught in lies. Constantly.
And why is it that Happy cannot EVER cite credible sources for his info? Obviously, because only other "conspiracy theorists" and cranks agree with him. He cites a long list of "institutions" that give percentages that agree with his own, but he doesn't provide a link. BECAUSE HE COMPLETELY MADE THE LIST UP, (or got it from one of his favorite sites, such as "The Christian Party" website, which also states that the "Holocaust was a hoax) AND CAN'T. Happy is a pathological liar, with an OBVIOUS agenda.
- SAINT GLv 51 decade ago
anyone who wastes police time through false reports should be given the sentence that would have gone to the person they accused. so if a person yells rape, and it is false, then they go to jail for the period that would have been handed out.
false accusations wreck lives too. even when it is proved that the accuser lied, the stigma of many crimes lingers. the action against the falsehoods should reflect that.
false calls about home invasions should be charged at what a home invader would get.
the malicious intent should be crushed.
- Elle MLv 41 decade ago
Don't take anything he says with a grain of salt. As proven in the link to his question on false allegations he was unable to prove anything. There was no preponderance of evidence. When he was called on this by Diedre, Wendy and Baba he became belligerent and began to call names. Does this sound logical?? Of course not. He has a few little peons who attempt to also prove these fabrications without as usual any concrete evidence. I have been studying stats for eons and the Department of Justice, and the FBI sites will send you any type of proof you need. Women are less likely to come forward because of reprisals from society. Rape is the only crime where the victim is not allowed any redress whatsoever. Who would go forward to report a case where they would end up being vilified by the press and mysoginists, as evidenced here in answers. Robinson I hope that someone close to you never experiences a violent sexual crime because you will never be able to forget how you went out of your way to denigrate victims. For any victims who read this rants ignore them because the men are only trying to revictimize you and God knows that is the last thing you deserve.
- ?Lv 61 decade ago
Even though rape is a serious crime, you can't just take someone's word for it that she (or he) has been raped--you need PROOF. Innocent until PROVEN guilty!
I think Cassius is right. If a girl has been raped and is not trying to falsely accuse anyone, she shouldn't be afraid to report it if she hasn't done anything wrong.
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- 1 decade ago
First of all, you need to understand that rape is the MOST UNREPORTED CRIME in America. The ones who do report, they are made to look like villians, or stupid. I have had the opportunity to counsel many victims of rape, and I will tell you, that although there are the liars, most are not lying. It is a hard crime to prove, if not reported immediately, or with witnesses. Rapists, are sad, sad little creatures, that need to have tons of counseling and cognitive therapy. It is a control issue, and it is never about the sex. Be very careful about endorsing someone who claims rape victims are liars.
- Anonymous1 decade ago
Well punish yes with maybe 3 months - 2 years but not ruin their lifes with a 20 years sentence or the like.
As for BABA YAGA I do not need to proove the high number of false rape accusations the way I do not need to proove the world is round. Somebody else did it for me already. Shocking isnt it ? I asked my question based on somone elses research, if you have issues with the results of the researches that have been conducted by several people adress them not me. Even if your 2-3% number from your questionabel source is right Baba Wendy, why not punish girls who make false accusation to strentghen the case of real rape victims ??
Nobody but you cited conspiracy theories of that site, or zhe patriarchy. Please quit linking to it over and over again WE ARE NOT INTERESTED IN SAVETHEWALES.WHATEVER Nobody on here is.
Same for you Rain, please tell us why you want to let women who make false accusations walk no matter if it is 3 40 or 95% ?
Pam where did I trivalize rape ? I did not. That is a lie. For some obscure reason you dont like me and feel an irresistibel impulse to say something negative about me.
Thank you Alexandra if it wouldnt have been for all those skanks who filed false accusations my sister would have not have to endure what she had to when she reported the assault (no rape thank god).
Wendy you have your thinking mixed up. The fact that up to 95% of accusations were false (in MY area) can not be offensive to real rape victims, after all they KNOW they have been raped. If anything they are offended over other people making false accusations toying with rape accusations as if it was some kind of game. They are angry at the ones making false claims and you should be too. Pointing out facts can not be offensive to rape victims. That equals pretty much to saying we must incarcerate everyone who is accused of rape to not offend rape victims, that makes absolutely no sense Wendy. Everyone here but you and your girlfriend sees it, Iam starting to think you do not want to understand, you just want to argue. Also I do not see what you hope to achieve by lying about the source I provided. Maybe on the sites where you got your "facts" about zhe patriarchy are those conspiracy theories, but not on my source.
RAIN all I do is advocate to punish women who make false accusations. If you do not have a problem with it, what are we fighting about anyway ?
Wendy you and baba yaga seem not to have any problems calling other people gay. Same game for everyone.
- 1 decade ago
Seeing as how the punishment for men who DO rape women is a joke (unless they kill them after they rape them), I can't imagine what the punishment would be for women who lie about being raped.
Women who lie about being raped are doing a disservice to the women who ARE raped. There should be consequences for women who lie about that.Source(s): My loser neighbor Jim Matthew Barnhart who tried to rape a 14 year old girl got a misdemeanor for it! That is IT! The judge is a friggin JERK who always let him off on all sorts of other things. He also tried to 'date' a 12 year old girl down the street. He's disgusting.
- 1 decade ago
Women are reluctant to come forth because of the shame of public exposure and the grueling court process which involves lines of questioning that are so manipulative as to make the victim feel as though she is the offender! Not to mention they publicly discuss her sexual history in order to shame her further. I’m thinking that this is why so many women don’t come forth.
In regards to Cassius's recent "findings" I would like to quote what journalist Di-ck Haws wrote about the variations of false rape reports - some very high and some very low. He also cited Cassius's "backer"
Di-ck Haws says:
"If you look to academe for such studies about false reports, you'll come across the UNUSUALLY high percentage found by the Purdue University sociologist Eugene J. Kanin, now retired. In an examination of rape reports from 1978 to 1987 in an unnamed midwestern city of 70,000, he found that of the 109 rapes reported to the police, 45, or 41 percent, were subsequently classified as false".
Cassius's supporter admits:
"Kanin of Purdue warned against reading too much into his examination of the small midwestern city: "Certainly our intent is not to suggest that the 41 percent incidence found here be extrapolated to other populations, particularly in light of our IGNORANCE regarding the structural variables."
When seeking out false rape statistics, the reporter suggests:
"The conclusion is clear. Don't rely on one source. Talk to the local sexual assault counselors, talk to the local police, talk to the FBI, talk to the academics. Try to make some sense out of all the different numbers. And be careful".
So Cassius, what was your REAL agenda when posting your pseudo "facts"??
Alexandra says: "she shouldnt be afraid to report it if she hasn't done anything wrong" You know what Alexandra, not only is your reasoning shallow, it sounds chillingly inhumane!
"Same for you Rain, please tell us why you want to let women who make false accusations walk no matter if it is 3 40 or 95%" ?
Pardon liar Cassius?? Tell me where I advocated THAT! Back it up! You can't Cassius. Why do you lie so much? Especailly when EVERYBODY can see that you do. Grow up.
Cassius, READ MY POST. Your source admitted he was IGNORANT and not to read too much into his examination!
You could have easily asked your "question" without posting your misleading statistics! This is why you you come across looking as though you have an...I don't know..AGENDA?! Get it?
- 1 decade ago
woo, look how hysterical everyone has gotten. Looks like Cassius hit a nerve in the old feminist dogma I suppose. Here are a few more statistics, such as - the REAL statistics from the FBI, Department of Justice and National Institute of Justice:
AN ALARMING NATIONAL TREND: FALSE RAPE ALLEGATIONS
"With the cooperation of the police agency of a small metropolitan community, 45 consecutive, disposed, false rape allegations covering a 9 year period were studied. False rape allegations constitute 41% of the total forcible rape cases (109) reported during this period. These false allegations appear to serve three major functions for the complainants: providing an alibi, seeking revenge, and obtaining sympathy and attention. False rape allegations are not the consequence of a gender-linked aberration, as frequently claimed, but reflect impulsive and desperate efforts to cope with personal and social stress situations. [False rape allegations are reported in similar numbers at college campuses; approximately 50% of rape charges are admitted to be false by the accuser.]"
NATIONAL COMMISSION OF THE FUTURE OF DNA EVIDENCE
"One bit of information that we have is we do somewhere have an estimate by I guess the FBI that in 30 percent of the cases where they now do DNA testing there is an exclusion, and the question is before there was DNA testing how many of those cases would have gone to trial with the suspect."
CONVICTED BY JURIES, EXONERATED BY SCIENCE
"Every year since 1989, in about 25 percent of the sexual assault cases referred to the FBI where results could be obtained (primarily by State and local law enforcement), the primary suspect has been excluded by forensic DNA testing."
"the National Institute of Justice's informal survey of private laboratories reveals a strikingly similar 26-percent exclusion rate, strongly suggests that postarrest and postconviction DNA exonerations are tied to some strong, underlying
systemic problems that generate erroneous accusations and convictions."
AN ALARMING NATIONAL TREND: STATISTICS: FALSE ACCUSATIONS OF SEXUAL ASSAULT
Citing a recent USA Today article, discussing the miracle of DNA and FBI studies of sexual assault suspects, DNA testing exonerated about 30 percent to 35 percent of the more than 4,000 sexual assault suspects on whom the FBI had conducted DNA testing over the past three years.
• In the FBI’s Behavioral Science Unit’s study of False Allegations conducted in 1983 of 556 rape investigations, a total of 220 (40%) of these reported rapes turned out to be false. Over one fourth of these 556 turned out to be hoaxes. And yet, some feminists and rape counselors claim that only two percent of rape reports are false.
• Linda Fairstein, who directs the prosecution of sexual assault in New York, says that there are approximately 4,000 reports of rape each year in Manhattan. Of these, about half simply did not happen. Says Fairstein, “It’s my job to bring justice to the man who has been falsely accused by a woman who has a grudge against him, just as it’s my job to prosecute the real thing.”
• In New Zealand, police officials have stated that 64 percent of rape reports are false and that some women are making a business out of being raped, collecting sometimes up to $10,000 compensation per case.
• The FBI stated that in 1990 over 8,500 of the rapes reported proved to be false. False reports of child abuse were twice that figure.
FEMINIST LIES DEBUNKED
WHO SAYS WOMEN NEVER LIE ABOUT RAPE + WENDERS GOT CAUGHT LYING (AGAIN)
"Actually, FBI statistics show that about 9 percent of rape reports are "unfounded" -- dismissed without charges being filed. The feminist party line is that most of these are valid complaints, nixed because the authorities lack sufficient proof or distrust acquaintance rape claims. But dismissals because of insufficient evidence usually occur further down the pipeline and are not in the "unfounded" category. Generally, a complaint is unfounded when the accuser recants or when her story is not just unsupported but contradicted by evidence."
"A Washington Post investigation in Virginia and Maryland found that nearly one in four rape reports in 1990-91 was unfounded. When contacted by the newspaper, many "victims" admitted they lied. More shocking figures come from a study by now-retired Purdue University sociologist Eugene Kanin published in Archives of Sexual Behavior in 1994. After reviewing the police records of an Indiana town, Kanin found that of 109 reports of rape filed in 1978-87, 45 -- or 41 percent -- turned out to be false, as the women themselves admitted after the investigation."
FALSE RAPE ACCUSATIONS MAY BE MORE COMMON THAN THOUGHT + 2% FIGURE IS A LIE
"Several years ago, I tried to track down the origin of this much-cited stat. The first instance I found of the figure was in Susan Brownmiller's book on sexual assault entitled "Against Our Will" (1975). Brownmiller claimed that false accusations in New York City had dropped to 2 percent after police departments began using policewomen to interview alleged victims."
"Elsewhere, the two percent figure appears without citation or with only a vague attribution to "FBI" sources. Although the figure shows up in legislation such as the Violence Against Women Act, legal scholar Michelle Anderson of Villanova University Law School reported in 2004, "no study has ever been published which sets forth an evidentiary basis for the two percent false rape complaint thesis.""
"In short, there is no reason to credit that figure.""
NOT ALL WOMEN ARE AS MISANDRIST AS FEMINISTS ON THE ISSUE
THIS WEBSITE HAS BEEN CREATED BY A CONCERNED MOTHER TO INCREASE AWARENESS THAT WOMEN OFTEN MAKE FALSE RAPE CHARGES
WOMEN LIE ABOUT RAPE
"Rape is a terrible crime. It should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. But false rape charges are a troublesome reality. At least 10 percent and perhaps as many as 40 percent of all rape charges are lies."
The sources so far are:
Purdue University (40%)
The peer reviewed journal: Archives of Sexual Behaviour (40%)
The peer reviewed journal: Forensic Science Digest (40%)
The Air Force Office of Special Investigations (60%)
The FBI Behavioural Science Unit (40%)
United States Department of Justice (30%)
United States National Institute of Justice (26%)
A 30% - 40% figure for false accusations of rape is well supported by a number of credible institutions. Give it up feminists, you're just exposing yourself as liars over and over again.