Pope's words.............uncanny????

what did the pope say that caused all the riot? What did he say about Islam?

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  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago
    Best Answer

    On Tuesday, September 12th, Pope Benedict XVI made a speech on "Faith and Reason" at the University of Regensburg in Germany and quoted from writings of an erudite 14th Century Byzantine Christian Emperor, Manuel II Palaiologos. Manuel II took notes during his dialogs in 1391 with the Persian Muderris at Ankara and his notebooks were preserved as the "Twenty-six Dialogs with a Persian" on the "truths of Christianity and Islam". The pontiff quoted Manuel II who said that spreading the faith through violence is unreasonable and that acting without reason was against God's nature.

    The pontiff said, "Speaking about the issue of jihad, holy war, the emperor [Manuel II] said, 'Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached.'"

    "Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul," added the pontiff in his own words.

    http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/spe...

    http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=46...

    Muslim reaction to that speech spanned from outrage to violence against nuns and churches. An Iraqi insurgent group threatened the Vatican with a suicide attack over the pope's remarks on Islam, according to a statement posted Saturday on the Web.

    "We swear to God to send you people who adore death as much as you adore life," said the message posted in the name of the Mujahedeen Army on a Web site frequently used by militant groups. The message's authenticity could not be independently verified. The statement was addressed to "you dog of Rome" and threatens to "shake your thrones and break your crosses in your home."

    Full statement by Vatican Secretary of State Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone on Pope Benedict XVI's response to Muslim anger over a speech he gave in Germany Tuesday... the pontiff was "very sorry" if he offended the sensibilities of Muslims worldwide.

    http://www.islamonline.net/English/News/2006-09/16...

    On Sunday, September 17th the pontiff said, " I am deeply sorry for the reactions in some countries to a few passages of my address at the University of Regensburg, which were considered offensive to the sensibility of Muslims."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5353774.stm

    Pope Benedict has the right to speak, he can certainly quote from the Bible and he can quote former Popes. His "apology" that he regrets Muslims became upset is appropriate because Muslims are always offended and humiliated whenever anything is said about Islam that is unflattering.

    Pope Benedict made the comments in a speech at the University of Regensburg which was probably a written speech and his remarks were probably carefully researched and edited. In my opinion, the quote was appropriate for the times of the Crusades. The quote also seems applicable to Islamic jihhadists today.

    Of course Muslims are outraged. It is a tenet of Islam that any time the religion is attacked that all Muslims have a duty to defend it. Violence gets attention. The timing of the speech is just before Ramadan. (Dates for Ramadan 2006 (or the Islamic year of 1427) are September 24th thru October 23rd.)

    I wonder what level of protection the Swiss guards at the Vatican provide? What kind of weapons do they have?

    Some contemporary evangelical Christian leaders such as Jerry Falwell and Jerry Vines have called Muhammad "a terrorist" and a "demon possessed pedophile who had twelve wives". Daniel Pipes sees Muhammad as a politician, stating that "because Muhammad created a new community, the religion that was its raison d'etre had to meet the political needs of its adherents." By contrast, Pope Benedict quoting Manual II is quite mild.

    Here is what Robbie Burns wrote and I think it can also be applied to jihaddists of today although it was written for Christians:

    "On Thanksgiving For A National Victory"

    Ye hypocrites are these your pranks

    to murder men and give God thanks?

    Desist, for shame proceed no further

    God does ne want your thanks for murder.

    Yah, I know, there is no compulsion in religion (2:256) and Islam is a peaceful religion. Taqiyah.

    The one page essay by Dr. Walid Phares, "Islamic concept of Al-Taqiyah to infiltrate and destroy kafir countries" explains how a convert will become a terrorist:

    http://www.fisiusa.org/fisi_News_items/news109.htm

    Phares states, "It [taqiyah] is done to prevent the new converts from seeing the real face of Islam; at least until their faith or mental conditioning is strong enough to make them turn against their own country and people."

    Not all Muslims blow up things, yet "jihad in the cause of Allah" "jihad fee sybil Allah" is "fard ayn" "compulsory duty" for all Muslims. Why? There are rules from the Quran for combattive jihad. Read this:

    http://www.notislam.com/id8.html

    What does the tape from Gadahn mean? Does anyone realize that Muslims are supposed to "dawa" "invite others to Islam" before jihad?

    According to al-Mawardi an 11th Century Shafi'i jurist:

    The mushrikun [infidels] of Dar al-Harb (the arena of battle) are of two types: First, those whom the call of Islam has reached, but they have refused it and have taken up arms.… Second, those whom the invitation to Islam has not reached, although such persons are few nowadays since Allah has made manifest the call of his Messenger…it is forbidden to…begin an attack before explaining the invitation to Islam to them, informing them of the miracles of the Prophet and making plain the proofs so as to encourage acceptance on their part; if they still refuse to accept after this, war is waged against them and they are treated as those whom the call has reached…

    In the Hidayah, vol. II. p. 140 (Hanafi school):

    It is not lawful to make war upon any people who have never before been called to the faith, without previously requiring them to embrace it, because the Prophet so instructed his commanders, directing them to call the infidels to the faith, and also because the people will hence perceive that they are attacked for the sake of religion, and not for the sake of taking their property, or making slaves of their children, and on this consideration it is possible that they may be induced to agree to the call, in order to save themselves from the troubles of war… If the infidels, upon receiving the call, neither consent to it nor agree to pay capitation tax, it is then incumbent on the Muslims to call upon God for assistance, and to make war upon them, because God is the assistant of those who serve Him, and the destroyer of His enemies, the infidels, and it is necessary to implore His aid upon every occasion; the Prophet, moreover, commands us so to do."

    Islam is insidious, it encroaches on a culture slowly and deliberately. Here is a document which discusses the progression of Islam in great detail (50+ pages) -- "From dawa to jihad - the various threats from radical Islam to the democratic legal order":

    http://www.fas.org/irp/world/netherlands/dawa.pdf

    Among Muslims there are those who:

    a) jihad in the path of Allah with their wealth and their lives (including those who sit at home but give asylum to mujahidin 4:74) = true Muslim

    b) those who sit at home (and do not give asylum to mujahidin or jihad in the path of Allah)

    c) the handicapped (does not count as a category)

    According to the Qur'an who is a true believer?

    3:140 If you have sustained a wound, _ (a blow in the battlefield) _ others too have suffered a similar kind of wound, earlier. These are the vicissitudes of life that We circulate among mankind by turns. Thus, Allah tests the true believers among you, so He may pick the martyrs among you. Allah does not like the wrongdoers.

    4:95 The two are not equal: those who sit at home (and do not join the fighting) _ unless they have a reason; they are handicapped _ and those who [jihad] strive hard in the path of Allah with their wealth and lives. Over those who sit at home, Allah has excelled and elevated to a higher honor those who strive hard with their wealth and lives.

    Compared to those who sit at home, Allah will award a far greater reward to those who wage a struggle.

    8:74 Those who believed, left their homes and waged a struggle for the cause of Allah as well as those who helped and protected them are really the true believers. There is forgiveness for them and a generous rewards.

    49:15 The (true) believers are actually those who believe in Allah and His messenger and then do not waver (and do not entertain doubts). With their wealth and their lives, they strive for the sake of Allah. Such are truly the sincere ones

    9:86 As soon as a chapter (of the Qur’an) is revealed (instructing them), “Believe in Allah and wage a struggle along with His messenger” the able bodied (and well to do) among them ask to be exempted. They say, “Leave us (behind). Let us be among those who sit at home

    Killing (qitl) and jihad in the cause of Allah is the hallmark of true Muslim believers. It is not a matter of moderate or fanatic. It is the distinction of a true believer or a rebel.

    4:76 Those who believe, do fight for the sake of Allah, while those who reject faith (Islam) fight for the cause of ‘taghut’ _ (all rebellious forces aligned against Allah). So, fight against the minions of Shaitan. Feeble indeed is the wily guile of Shaitan!

    Does this include atomic weapons?

    8:60 Acquire and prepare all the (military) strength you can muster, including the finest trained horses (and other military wares). With that, you would daunt and deter the enemies of Allah _ your enemies, and others besides them. You do not know them, but Allah (surely) knows them. Anything you spend in the path of Allah will be returned to you in full. You will not be wronged (at all).

    2:216 Warfare (for the sake of Allah) has been ordained for you, though it is not something you like. It is possible that the thing you detest might just (turn out to) be good for you. It is possible that the thing you like (the most) might in reality be bad for you. Allah knows (all) while you know nothing (at all)!

    4:74 Those who have traded away the life of this world for (the benefits of) the life-to-come, ought to fight for the sake of Allah. To anyone who fights for the sake of Allah, We will award the most generous reward whether he is killed (in the process) or comes out victorious.

    These verses from the Qur'an can give us insight into the mind of a Muslim believer and the peaceful religion of Islam. Do read the entire sura from which they were extracted to get the entire context of the verses. It may make a difference.

  • Vayu W
    Lv 4
    1 decade ago

    One thing is sure... "We are all Papists now."

    And this shoot comes from Hindus, Buddhists and Sikhs alike...

    Last year when there was a major convention lead by the leadership of the Iranian governemnt, all major Islamic organizations in the world, enthusiastically attended the conferences... that is:

    -The Muslim League,

    -the Muslim Brotherhood,

    -The Arab League,

    -leaders of major Islamic countries such as Saoudi Arabia, Egypt and Syria and many more all attended this conference pro-actively and with willingness to feed this blatant insult on humanity's collective memory...

    The subject of the conference:

    "Why did the West made up the Holocauste ?"

    I haven't seen anyone rioting or killing for that one yet ! Nor have I seen anyone rioting to stop the Arabo-Muslim tribes killing other black muslims and non muslims in Darfour, nor have I seen an rioting or excuses by any, and I mean any Islamic clerics who insulted westerners, christians or Hindus on a weekly basis.....

    Now regarding the Pope's lecture,

    What the Pope argued last week is not strikingly original. Many of the contemporary critiques of Islam have dwelt at length on the fact that the apparent finality of the Koran has made it difficult for Islam to experience a Reformation. What is also undeniable is that whereas the claims of Islam to be a religion of peace have been unceasingly made, almost all the Islamists have justified their terrorism in terms of religious obligation.

    Heinous crimes have been committed and justified in the name of religion. Concern has also been voiced that the tenets of brotherhood in Islam do not always extend to non-believers, making them incompatible with multi-religious existence.

    These are issue which warrant dispassionate debate and dialogue. The Pope may have been injudicious in citing a 14th century assessment by a Byzantine emperor but the questions he has raised are relevant both in theological and political terms. What is alarming is the fierce reaction to his lecture. They suggest that any debate on Islam based on critical scrutiny is bound to be accompanied by threats and intimidation. Far from encouraging sympathetic understanding of Muslim societies, this climate of intolerance is certain to fuel Islamophobia

  • fallie
    Lv 4
    3 years ago

    probable not appropriate away, yet faster or later Francis the 1st Is greater advantageous than probable going to come again into the motions that different recent Popes have had and sell the consolidation of all religions right into a United "One international faith". This has been a significant schedule by ability of many effectual communities alongside with former Pope Benedict.

  • 1 decade ago

    part if his speech:

    I was reminded of all this recently, when I read... of part of the dialogue carried on - perhaps in 1391 in the winter barracks near Ankara - by the erudite Byzantine Emperor Manuel II Paleologus and an educated Persian on the subject of Christianity and Islam, and the truth of both.

    In the seventh conversation...the emperor touches on the theme of the holy war. Without descending to details, such as the difference in treatment accorded to those who have the "Book" and the "infidels", he addresses his interlocutor with a startling brusqueness on the central question about the relationship between religion and violence in general, saying: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

    The emperor, after having expressed himself so forcefully, goes on to explain in detail the reasons why spreading the faith through violence is something unreasonable. Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul. "God," he says, "is not pleased by blood - and not acting reasonably is contrary to God's nature. Faith is born of the soul, not the body. Whoever would lead someone to faith needs the ability to speak well and to reason properly, without violence and threats."

    Source(s): you can get the whole speech here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5348456.stm
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  • 1 decade ago

    Here is a link to the English translation of the Pope's speech: http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/spe...

    With love in Christ.

  • ?
    Lv 4
    1 decade ago

    The pope need to worry about the "Whore of Revelation" and worry about himself

    1) has a Christian religious heritage,

    2) is waxed exceedingly rich,

    3) has the blood of Saints and Martyrs on her hands,

    4) has tremendous political and religious influence throughout the world,

    5) is clothed in purple and scarlet,

    6) is located near the Mediterranean Sea,

    7) is full of abominations, primarily idols,

    8) is heavily adorned with gold and jewels,

    9) is primarily represented by a woman instead of Jesus Christ,

    10) is carrying a golden chalice, significant to her identity,

    11) influences world leaders because of her religious power,

    12) sits on seven mountains or hills.

  • 1 decade ago

    Why do you find it uncanny? The current pope has a history of being a fascist bigot. Slamming Islam is only one more hate spreading tactic.

    I am not even surprised at his racist bigoted remarks.

  • 1 decade ago

    Benedict quoted criticism of Islam and the Prophet Mohammad by 14th century Byzantine Emperor Manuel II Palaeologus, who wrote that everything Mohammad brought was evil and inhuman, "such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."

    Benedict, who used the terms "jihad" and "holy war," repeatedly quoted Manuel's argument that spreading the faith through violence was unreasonable, adding: "Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul."

  • Anonymous
    1 decade ago

    Only the truth.

    Muslims want to spread they are a religion of peace, so when someone points out otherwise (the truth) they yell a scream "Oh, we are insulted" but it is o.k. to kill hundreds a day.

    The truth hurts sometime, doesn't it Islam?

    **

    O.K. 3 td? I guess I offended the Muslims.

    Read this http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060917/ap_on_re_eu/po... and tell me that they aren't a violent group. . .

    They get offended and they terrorize everything. On top of that they swear to attack the Vatican.

    GIVE ME A BREAK! How in the world can any one call this a Peaceful religion? They want to kill everyone who doesn't think their way.

  • 1 decade ago

    Benedict said that violence is not in accord with God's will, no matter whom is God's agent.

  • 1 decade ago

    HE PROBABLY TOLD THEM THE TRUTH, AND SOME TIMES THE TRUTH HURTS..

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